This is a list of problems facing society today...
-Overpopulation - too many people; no food, water, housing, etc.
-Pollution - environmental damages
-Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc.
-War - people killing each other for bad reasons
-Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education
-Obesity/Disease - people dying from poor decisions or bad luck
-Habitat Destruction - people destroy nature to make room for more people
-Species Extinction - above practices causing diversity of life to diminish
-Religion - People believe many conflicting ideas
Are these all problems? Some conflict (overpopulation, disease killing people). What are your thoughts? What are other major "problems"?
There's only one problem, matey, and that's US!!
Now, lets sort ourselves out, shall we?
Now, lets sort ourselves out, shall we?
The general, average, normal majority--is the major problem.
The mentalities and values could use some work.
Most possible solutions?
Better leadership, mainly. Civization's problems are far too complex for 1 or 2 people to just figure out.
War is not a problem right now. Only a small percentage of people die because of war. Only some nations are destroying their environments, whilst other nations are conservative and smarter with their resources.
Here's one:
Funding of mulitary being up into public education and science, instead. This isn't gunnu happen, but allot of money goes into the military.
Primary issues:
Where do the leaders get their power from?
How do they get their power?
What does their power want them to do?
What do they want to do with their power?
Let's look back at a developed modern culture.
The main way of life & goals of most masses today are:
Work. Consume products. Get your mind altered by the media. Try to prevent personal death.
Irresponsable corporate monsters and nearsighted beurocracies are a huge issue for humanities future.
The average civilian is not "in control" of what's mainly happening to the world, because he doesn't have "the power". The desires of the majority and the leaders, that's where "the power" is.
...We have no nihilist governers, so even the leaders are usedto things; "programmed like everyone else", you could say. Human idiosynracy is a hidden assassin of the future.
It's out of my hands. I think that the problem is deeply ingrained within the masses and the leaders that "control" those masses. I will say this, flat out:
Humanities biggest problem is a lack of understanding within the masses. Most people's instinct is stronger then their logic; they are irresponsable and wasteful with their own lives and the world around them.
The mentalities and values could use some work.
Most possible solutions?
Better leadership, mainly. Civization's problems are far too complex for 1 or 2 people to just figure out.
War is not a problem right now. Only a small percentage of people die because of war. Only some nations are destroying their environments, whilst other nations are conservative and smarter with their resources.
Here's one:
Funding of mulitary being up into public education and science, instead. This isn't gunnu happen, but allot of money goes into the military.
Primary issues:
Where do the leaders get their power from?
How do they get their power?
What does their power want them to do?
What do they want to do with their power?
Let's look back at a developed modern culture.
The main way of life & goals of most masses today are:
Work. Consume products. Get your mind altered by the media. Try to prevent personal death.
Irresponsable corporate monsters and nearsighted beurocracies are a huge issue for humanities future.
The average civilian is not "in control" of what's mainly happening to the world, because he doesn't have "the power". The desires of the majority and the leaders, that's where "the power" is.
...We have no nihilist governers, so even the leaders are usedto things; "programmed like everyone else", you could say. Human idiosynracy is a hidden assassin of the future.
It's out of my hands. I think that the problem is deeply ingrained within the masses and the leaders that "control" those masses. I will say this, flat out:
Humanities biggest problem is a lack of understanding within the masses. Most people's instinct is stronger then their logic; they are irresponsable and wasteful with their own lives and the world around them.
Overfishing issues and the eco-system:
http://www.napa.ufl.edu/2001news/overfishing.htm
Essay about overpopulation issues, here:
http://www.planetpapers.com/Assets/4683.php
All of the "Good" that has happened recently [medacine and agriculture], is perhaps one of the main factors of the sharp population increase, which then becomes our worst problem on earth.
Strangely, a nihilist once said: "our greatest strength is our greatest weakness".
This philosophy definitely applies to our population issues, though the comment was originally directed at the abstract thought capability of our "higher intelligence". The better we get at reproducing and surviving, the more screwed we are globally!, as an over populating species.
I personally protest to sex. I will not have kids. Most people are the opposite. I've always believed that as our lives get longer and healthier, we should become less sexual, and eventually reach a stand-still [perfect body-system repair, asexual immortals]. But now I see the opposite is the average, and these more healthy, longer living beings reproduce more.
When really looking at it, humanities main problem is overpopulation, IMHO. When I was previously talking about the main problem being the corporations and beurocracies, I'd forgot to say: These beurocracies and corporations should not only reduce consumption, but also population, if possible. Even worse: the underdeveloped nations don't have the kind of infrastructures needed to control reproduction of the masses. How much are the ritch and the powerful willing to invest upon controlling the population of the poor and the ignorant? It just isn't going to happen! Our species is headed for a crash! Nobody is going to stop this overpopulation issue. Overpopulation isn't such an issue in the more developed nations.
I've personally just said to myself:
This is impossible. My only salvation within the future would be a new and more resiliant body upload, or a cryogenic preservation that lasted through the "neo-darkages" [as I call them].
Perhaps a transhumanistic solution?
Anairobic plant species with high intelligence and man-like physical ability, perhaps?
http://www.napa.ufl.edu/2001news/overfishing.htm
Essay about overpopulation issues, here:
http://www.planetpapers.com/Assets/4683.php
All of the "Good" that has happened recently [medacine and agriculture], is perhaps one of the main factors of the sharp population increase, which then becomes our worst problem on earth.
Strangely, a nihilist once said: "our greatest strength is our greatest weakness".
This philosophy definitely applies to our population issues, though the comment was originally directed at the abstract thought capability of our "higher intelligence". The better we get at reproducing and surviving, the more screwed we are globally!, as an over populating species.
I personally protest to sex. I will not have kids. Most people are the opposite. I've always believed that as our lives get longer and healthier, we should become less sexual, and eventually reach a stand-still [perfect body-system repair, asexual immortals]. But now I see the opposite is the average, and these more healthy, longer living beings reproduce more.
When really looking at it, humanities main problem is overpopulation, IMHO. When I was previously talking about the main problem being the corporations and beurocracies, I'd forgot to say: These beurocracies and corporations should not only reduce consumption, but also population, if possible. Even worse: the underdeveloped nations don't have the kind of infrastructures needed to control reproduction of the masses. How much are the ritch and the powerful willing to invest upon controlling the population of the poor and the ignorant? It just isn't going to happen! Our species is headed for a crash! Nobody is going to stop this overpopulation issue. Overpopulation isn't such an issue in the more developed nations.
I've personally just said to myself:
This is impossible. My only salvation within the future would be a new and more resiliant body upload, or a cryogenic preservation that lasted through the "neo-darkages" [as I call them].
Perhaps a transhumanistic solution?
Anairobic plant species with high intelligence and man-like physical ability, perhaps?
There has to be someway to control population.
I think that nature has continuously thrown disasters at us to lower our numbers. Through global weather change, nature will destroy many lives and ultimately reduce the population. Diseases, killing own environment, and even self-interest and greed of humans may also be programmed into nature. Perhaps stupidity arises from the surplus of organisms (that is us).
The question is whether or not nature will ever catch up to our growth.
I think that nature has continuously thrown disasters at us to lower our numbers. Through global weather change, nature will destroy many lives and ultimately reduce the population. Diseases, killing own environment, and even self-interest and greed of humans may also be programmed into nature. Perhaps stupidity arises from the surplus of organisms (that is us).
The question is whether or not nature will ever catch up to our growth.
What is stupid is believing that we are separate from Nature. Our greed is Natures greed. Nature is just trying out Insanity for a while, to see what happens next...See if it can 'cure' itself, or if not 'cleanse' itself, and start again with another toy...
The top 1 for me should be poverty. Coz that's the source of all.
QUOTE
When really looking at it, humanities main problem is overpopulation, IMHO. When I was previously talking about the main problem being the corporations and beurocracies, I'd forgot to say: These beurocracies and corporations should not only reduce consumption, but also population, if possible. Even worse: the underdeveloped nations don't have the kind of infrastructures needed to control reproduction of the masses. How much are the ritch and the powerful willing to invest upon controlling the population of the poor and the ignorant? It just isn't going to happen! Our species is headed for a crash! Nobody is going to stop this overpopulation issue. Overpopulation isn't such an issue in the more developed nations.
I don't think over population is a problem at this point in time. It might be some day, but if we are smart about it (which we are not) the earth has the capability to support much more people than are here now. At any rate, I don't see a need to control the population. Just for a second, think about what life was like in north america 100 or 200 years ago. Many people lived out on farms. Any of you have family who grew up on farms? They had a lot more kids right? And now that we are more industrialized and more mechanized here people have less kids. I think in Canada the population growth is quite small, if it is even positive. Other industrialized nations are also not growing very fast through the birth rate. Where there is lots of growth is where there is less development technologically. If/when some of these countries industrialize, I would expect to see their growth rates drop off quite a lot. Not because people are not having sex, but because people are not wanting/needing lots of kids. Using protection, and such. What we should do if you are really worried about overpopulation is support helping undeveloped countries industrialize, in a way that doesn't exploit tons of people and destroy the envirnoment. In a lot of cases the west is directly responsible for these undeveloped countries current states, so we should help them develop. Control is not needed in my opinion, and controlling populations is also not justified in my opinion.
One that should be up there is the biological imprfections of humans. That is, after all, the cause of many of the other problems up there. Global warming probably shouldn't be up there because it is just a branch off from pollution. Greed is another good one but I think that can fall under 'biological imperfection'.
Ahhhhhhhhhha AAhhhhhhhhhhhhhaaaaa! Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhha
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh' Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh' Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhh!
I think the #1 problem facing the world today is centralization of social control. This is likely an issue that must eventually come to the forefront of social debates. We used to have a more diverse and independent world and this had protections built in that no longer exist. A tyrant 200 years ago would have found it virtually impossible to rule the world or trash more than their own backyard (and a few neighboring areas), but today, global interactions and social trends are removing many of these natural factors that protected isolated communities.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
QUOTE (StevenA+Apr 26 2006, 12:07 PM)
I think the #1 problem facing the world today is centralization of social control.
I second that opinion.
apathy/complacency
herd mentality in an increasingly networked world - many pawns for many agendas
erosion of personal integrity
massive ignorance of the sweeping power of ever-growing technology in the hands of a few
- a devil's brew which cannot but lead to empire
I second that opinion.
apathy/complacency
herd mentality in an increasingly networked world - many pawns for many agendas
erosion of personal integrity
massive ignorance of the sweeping power of ever-growing technology in the hands of a few
- a devil's brew which cannot but lead to empire
QUOTE
-Overpopulation - too many people; no food, water, housing, etc.
This is only a problem because people choose it this way. There is room and resources enough on this planet for its current population, however, a rich minority (a large part of the western capitalistic society) will have to reduce its lifestyle before the resources can be divided equally over the globe.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| -Overpopulation - too many people; no food, water, housing, etc. |
This is only a problem because people choose it this way. There is room and resources enough on this planet for its current population, however, a rich minority (a large part of the western capitalistic society) will have to reduce its lifestyle before the resources can be divided equally over the globe.
-Pollution - environmental damages
Pollution can be reduced and enviromental damages can be stopped. This however costs money (profit) so, it will not happen.
QUOTE
-Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc.
Most of these are through emissions of waste products, however, resolving this issue can never be done. Because in the end, all Work will end up producing heat, and as long as we produce more heat then that we can radiate off into space, the globe will heat up.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| -Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc. |
Most of these are through emissions of waste products, however, resolving this issue can never be done. Because in the end, all Work will end up producing heat, and as long as we produce more heat then that we can radiate off into space, the globe will heat up.
-War - people killing each other for bad reasons
There are no bad reasons, just reasons that are catagorized based on each viewpoint. Mostly, war is for resources.
QUOTE
-Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education
Also true, nobody is interested in education because they are mentally stimulated to not be interested. A few have the power and with that resources, and they will try to keep all compettitors down. This is done through media and politics.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| -Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education |
Also true, nobody is interested in education because they are mentally stimulated to not be interested. A few have the power and with that resources, and they will try to keep all compettitors down. This is done through media and politics.
-Obesity/Disease - people dying from poor decisions or bad luck
Disease happens, maybe it is annoying for a few, but for humanity at large, the survivors are stronger.
Obesity Is a luxury problem. media propaganda and general laziness cause this. People that eat more food than they require for their upkeep because they do not work physically, and also the easy availability of fast fat food.
Poor decisions or bad luck are just that. Bad luck is bad luck if you can call it that way. Poor decisions is culling the weak.
QUOTE
-Habitat Destruction - people destroy nature to make room for more people
That is money, it costs more work/money/time to adapt to the enviroment than that it costs to adapt the enviroment to your cheapest solution.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| -Habitat Destruction - people destroy nature to make room for more people |
That is money, it costs more work/money/time to adapt to the enviroment than that it costs to adapt the enviroment to your cheapest solution.
-Species Extinction - above practices causing diversity of life to diminish
Yes, effect of the basic cause.
QUOTE
-Religion - People believe many conflicting ideas
Organised religion is bad. It boils down to having a select few deciding what and how to think and act. And since these select few want to have most resources available to them, they want to stay in power, thus they will keep their subordinates uneducated and discourage or even punish any thought that goes against their issued believes. Having multiple religions being indoctrinated different things does not help either. The only solution is education based on a strict principle and giving people the basic knowledge to examine all things themselves and make up their own mind, but try and prevent them to organise and have a few of them rule others with their ideas.
I hear you on the lack of concern for education. When I was at high school the only way you were successful is if you were good at sport. I was really good at English but that just didn't count. I was terrible at sport and even the teachers picked on me. People just don't seem to respect education any more. I am afraid to think what my children will be in for.
SUP NIGGASSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
This is a list of problems facing society today...
Statement>-Overpopulation - too many people; no food, water, housing, etc.
Answer> Encourage acceptable, to ability to sustain, population growth.Tell the truth concerning aliens contact, that it was made back in the 60s under Eisenhower, which resulted in the cobase agreements.Let the people who want to, leave Earth, to be relocated elsewhere, rather than be forced to stay here on Earth?
-Pollution - environmental damages
Ans> Make recycling mandatory, with three separate containers, nationwide, for all three types of recyclables.This would be for people who do not want to return their recyclables for profit.Give a recycling credit, on year end taxes, for people who have the concern and vision in order to recycle?
-Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc.
ans> Institute electric autos and trucks, using improved methods of nanostructured high efficiency solar cells, for trucks autos and other movers.Allow gas recreation allowances, but with a permit only, such as for boats, tractors, motorcycles, or light users for gasoline.
Outlaw fluorocarbons in most materials sold.
-War - people killing each other for bad reasons
Ans> War is a socio-economic-political object, this must be shown to international agreements, of being stopped?
-Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education
ans> This is relative, due to the electronic frontier.Not all people are dumb, however within society, it does seem, that the powers that be, want to train people to be rat-maize like?
-Obesity/Disease - people dying from poor decisions or bad luck
Ans, Nonsequiter??
-Habitat Destruction - people destroy nature to make room for more people
Ans, again, be allowed to transfer some of the population from Earth, that does not want to stay here?
-Species Extinction - above practices causing diversity of life to diminish
Ans, This statement bears to be lit?
-Religion - People believe many conflicting ideas
ans, Religion is a personal issue.
Allow some people on Earth, who do not want to stay here, to be able to relocate from or off of Earth, is they either don't like it here, or want to be transferred anyway?
Are these all problems? Some conflict (overpopulation, disease killing people). What are your thoughts? What are other major "problems"?
Statement>-Overpopulation - too many people; no food, water, housing, etc.
Answer> Encourage acceptable, to ability to sustain, population growth.Tell the truth concerning aliens contact, that it was made back in the 60s under Eisenhower, which resulted in the cobase agreements.Let the people who want to, leave Earth, to be relocated elsewhere, rather than be forced to stay here on Earth?
-Pollution - environmental damages
Ans> Make recycling mandatory, with three separate containers, nationwide, for all three types of recyclables.This would be for people who do not want to return their recyclables for profit.Give a recycling credit, on year end taxes, for people who have the concern and vision in order to recycle?
-Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc.
ans> Institute electric autos and trucks, using improved methods of nanostructured high efficiency solar cells, for trucks autos and other movers.Allow gas recreation allowances, but with a permit only, such as for boats, tractors, motorcycles, or light users for gasoline.
Outlaw fluorocarbons in most materials sold.
-War - people killing each other for bad reasons
Ans> War is a socio-economic-political object, this must be shown to international agreements, of being stopped?
-Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education
ans> This is relative, due to the electronic frontier.Not all people are dumb, however within society, it does seem, that the powers that be, want to train people to be rat-maize like?
-Obesity/Disease - people dying from poor decisions or bad luck
Ans, Nonsequiter??
-Habitat Destruction - people destroy nature to make room for more people
Ans, again, be allowed to transfer some of the population from Earth, that does not want to stay here?
-Species Extinction - above practices causing diversity of life to diminish
Ans, This statement bears to be lit?
-Religion - People believe many conflicting ideas
ans, Religion is a personal issue.
Allow some people on Earth, who do not want to stay here, to be able to relocate from or off of Earth, is they either don't like it here, or want to be transferred anyway?
Are these all problems? Some conflict (overpopulation, disease killing people). What are your thoughts? What are other major "problems"?
QUOTE (Guest_eric+Nov 6 2006, 01:26 AM)
u dont have to be meanhttp://forum.physorg.com/style_images/1/icon6.gif
u dont have to be mean :
u dont have to be mean :
QUOTE (PhilP+)
Are these all problems? Some conflict (overpopulation, disease killing people). What are your thoughts? What are other major "problems"?
Nuclear proliferation
Religious fundamentalism
Mutations that form dangerous viruses
Nuclear proliferation
Religious fundamentalism
Mutations that form dangerous viruses
Self Love plain an simple.
Money becomes a tool, so does religion, so does government.
When everyone only cares about them selves, you get chaos, destruction, shortcuts that lead to disease, cuts that proliferate disease, weather gaps that promote crime, race gaps that promote hatred, etc, etc.
If everyone were to have a magic switch inside their brains turned on, so that everyone no longer cared about them selves, but "everyone" else instead - a care that resulted in personal sacrifices, I see instant crime/war irradiation, extremely heightened pollution awareness that would result in drastic changes to vehicles, industry. Race issues would be gone, poverty gone, etc, etc.
Money becomes a tool, so does religion, so does government.
When everyone only cares about them selves, you get chaos, destruction, shortcuts that lead to disease, cuts that proliferate disease, weather gaps that promote crime, race gaps that promote hatred, etc, etc.
If everyone were to have a magic switch inside their brains turned on, so that everyone no longer cared about them selves, but "everyone" else instead - a care that resulted in personal sacrifices, I see instant crime/war irradiation, extremely heightened pollution awareness that would result in drastic changes to vehicles, industry. Race issues would be gone, poverty gone, etc, etc.
Take a map of Earth at night. How many lights are there in the Americas? Africa? There is more space and nutrients available out there than you would think. What we need to worry about for now is how we get our resources and how we can proptect the Earth. After that, we need to address our lack of FTL tech. (half serious, half joking)
i want boobs.
QUOTE (StevenA+Apr 26 2006, 12:07 PM)
I think the #1 problem facing the world today is centralization of social control. This is likely an issue that must eventually come to the forefront of social debates. We used to have a more diverse and independent world and this had protections built in that no longer exist. A tyrant 200 years ago would have found it virtually impossible to rule the world or trash more than their own backyard (and a few neighboring areas), but today, global interactions and social trends are removing many of these natural factors that protected isolated communities.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
Impressive piece, accurate, to the point and well written, not to mention I am not sure how anyone with a basic understanding of history and conflict could disagree with it.... nice job.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
Impressive piece, accurate, to the point and well written, not to mention I am not sure how anyone with a basic understanding of history and conflict could disagree with it.... nice job.
the main problem is sin... people just need to get back to God
QUOTE (IgottaGETouttaHERE+Apr 16 2006, 08:04 PM)
-Global Warming - chlorofluorocarbons, etc
CFC are to do with the Ozone layer depletion, not global warming.
Ignorance
Gullibility
Apathy
Greed
Gullibility
Apathy
Greed
isn't everything around us a problem?
QUOTE (Guest_eric+Nov 6 2006, 01:26 AM)
SUP NIGGASSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
i think that is very racial
i think that is very racial
QUOTE (Guest_eric+Nov 6 2006, 01:26 AM)
SUP NIGGASSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
Thats one problem facing society.
Thats one problem facing society.
islam will be the biggest problem if it isnt now.
Top ten problems facing society... Good question! I can explain any of these individual points further, but here is my off-the cuff riff of AT LEAST 10 major issues I see...
1) media concentration (the 4th check and balance of any free society...)
2) diffuse power without oversight and accountability (think "pan-global corporate oligarchy...)
3) diffusion of responsibility (the other guy will do it...)
3) jungian style shadow projection (the other guy did it!)
4) the united states electoral process (can we say "INSTANT RUN-OFF"?)
5) self-censorship (Foucault's Pendulum anyone?)
6) the policy of preemption (think GAME THEORY...)
7) virgins in heaven (at least 40 of them...)
8) the technological 4th wall (the technology that promises to connect us, in fact isolates us...)
9) climate change (WHATEVER the reasons... duh!)
10) reliance upon non-renewable sources of energy (leading to inevitable conflict...)
note the absence of nuclear bombs from the list. self destruction is largely a symptom in my view, not a cause. some other issues? the normalization of dogma, fear, shame and... oh! how could I forget! the united states systematic destruction of civil liberties should be on that list, scientific censorship... hmmm... I'll stop there. Too hard to pick JUST 10...
1) media concentration (the 4th check and balance of any free society...)
2) diffuse power without oversight and accountability (think "pan-global corporate oligarchy...)
3) diffusion of responsibility (the other guy will do it...)
3) jungian style shadow projection (the other guy did it!)
4) the united states electoral process (can we say "INSTANT RUN-OFF"?)
5) self-censorship (Foucault's Pendulum anyone?)
6) the policy of preemption (think GAME THEORY...)
7) virgins in heaven (at least 40 of them...)
8) the technological 4th wall (the technology that promises to connect us, in fact isolates us...)
9) climate change (WHATEVER the reasons... duh!)
10) reliance upon non-renewable sources of energy (leading to inevitable conflict...)
note the absence of nuclear bombs from the list. self destruction is largely a symptom in my view, not a cause. some other issues? the normalization of dogma, fear, shame and... oh! how could I forget! the united states systematic destruction of civil liberties should be on that list, scientific censorship... hmmm... I'll stop there. Too hard to pick JUST 10...
There is only 1 problem:
We do not understand how Nature works.
We do not understand how Nature works.
nothing cracker
QUOTE (IgottaGETouttaHERE+Apr 17 2006, 08:04 AM)
-Stupidity - general population becoming less concerned with education
And what if everyone was very well educated? Who would be wanting to do the jobs such as retail, taxi driver, etc.? Without robots to do these for us we instead have over-qualified people, an ever increasing percentage of whom will almost certainly develop a grudge against society. More and more people will strike out against society; crime rates will increase. Another path to a bleak future.
And what if everyone was very well educated? Who would be wanting to do the jobs such as retail, taxi driver, etc.? Without robots to do these for us we instead have over-qualified people, an ever increasing percentage of whom will almost certainly develop a grudge against society. More and more people will strike out against society; crime rates will increase. Another path to a bleak future.
QUOTE
And what if everyone was very well educated? Who would be wanting to do the jobs such as retail, taxi driver, etc.?
Everyone cannot be equally well educated. There will allways be some people who are less educated than the others. If most people had PHDs, those with Bachelors degrees would drive cabs and probably not care.
The "pecking order" among humans will remain. The level of our education will not stop this.
QUOTE (vkamath+Sep 7 2007, 02:17 PM)
Everyone cannot be equally well educated. There will allways be some people who are less educated than the others. If most people had PHDs, those with Bachelors degrees would drive cabs and probably not care.
The "pecking order" among humans will remain. The level of our education will not stop this.
Hypothetically, would you not care if you were at the lower end of such a pecking order, even though you were more than capable of undertaking more rewarding work?
No resentment at investing time [and money] in education which you can't apply?
QUOTE (doom3million+)
Hypothetically, would you not care if you were at the lower end of such a pecking order, even though you were more than capable of undertaking more rewarding work?
With everyone around me being PhDs, there would be no other work more rewarding. So I would be resigned to my fate...just like the cab drivers of today.
With everyone around me being PhDs, there would be no other work more rewarding. So I would be resigned to my fate...just like the cab drivers of today.
Everyone talking about problems, nobody talking about solutions. This is a puzzling question forum, where one answers puzzling questions. 
So, some answers:
http://www.calvert-henderson.com/ to provide a foundation to evaluate human values in economic decisions
http://www.newrules.org/index.htm designing for community
http://www.therealnews.com/web/index.php get the truth to the people, a work in progress
http://reclaimdemocracy.org/personhood/ let the people decide
http://www.edge.org/q2006/q06_index.html we need to ask dangerous questions
http://www.edge.org/questioncenter.html actually, we need to ask all kinds of things
And, a slightly different take on the source of the problems:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatocracy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juristic_person
So, there are a lot of really smart people out there trying to make a difference. If nothing else, ask yourself what you did today to make their job easier.
So, some answers:
http://www.calvert-henderson.com/ to provide a foundation to evaluate human values in economic decisions
http://www.newrules.org/index.htm designing for community
http://www.therealnews.com/web/index.php get the truth to the people, a work in progress
http://reclaimdemocracy.org/personhood/ let the people decide
http://www.edge.org/q2006/q06_index.html we need to ask dangerous questions
http://www.edge.org/questioncenter.html actually, we need to ask all kinds of things
And, a slightly different take on the source of the problems:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporatocracy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juristic_person
So, there are a lot of really smart people out there trying to make a difference. If nothing else, ask yourself what you did today to make their job easier.
[FONT=Impact][SIZE=1]idk
QUOTE (meBigGuy+Sep 10 2007, 12:02 AM)
So, there are a lot of really smart people out there trying to make a difference. If nothing else, ask yourself what you did today to make their job easier.
There are different ways to contribute to society.
There are different ways to contribute to society.
QUOTE (StevenA+Apr 26 2006, 07:07 AM)
I think the #1 problem facing the world today is centralization of social control. This is likely an issue that must eventually come to the forefront of social debates. We used to have a more diverse and independent world and this had protections built in that no longer exist. A tyrant 200 years ago would have found it virtually impossible to rule the world or trash more than their own backyard (and a few neighboring areas), but today, global interactions and social trends are removing many of these natural factors that protected isolated communities.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
I would agree with your post. Contrary to the socialist and liberal agendas, statehood is a good thing that allows us to protect ourselves from the evils of other cultures, whether they be individuals or ideologies. One world government and centralized governing bodies such as the UN will lead to greater catastrophes than true statehood.
How are we responsible? This whole liberal "spread the blame around" mentality is one of the things that is destroying the social fabric of western civilization.
In so many of these foriegn nations, American and European missionaries have been trying for generations to teach these people some simblance of morality and decency, even to the point of shipping them condoms by the ton and trying to educate them about disease and safe sex, and still they have a 30% aids rate. Who's fault is that? is it ours? No. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink.
If you want to blame yourself for the African Aids epidemic and other 3rd world problems that aren't our fault, well, you are free to do so.
Just don't blame me and the 1.5 billion people who's fault it isn't.
//--//
And this reminds me. My brother-in-law had to be hospitalized a while back on a short term basis due to a fainting problem he had caused by a blood pressure problem. He is a healthy, fit guy, so its not like he is lazy or anything. Anyway, he is required to pay the hospital over thirty thousand dollars for medical expenses. Since he makes too much money to get any sort of deferment or anything, they want the payment in far more than he and my sister can afford to pay per month. Now, turn on the news and see how American hospitals give free care to Iraqi kids and some boy monk, and do procedures that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars for free. this is unconstitutional and borderline treason, yet nobody seems to complain about it. They will literally give free care to the very people who want to kill us, but want to over charge American citizens. In fact, the reason Americans who make money pay so much is to pay for all the people who either can't pay or refuse to pay. I believe in social programs and medical programs for AMERICAN CITIZENS who actually need it, but this bit of giving expensive treatments to people who would just as well kill us is ridiculous, and giving huge amounts of money to foriegn nations with no return is unconstitutional, because it amounts to paying tribute to foreign nations, when we owe them nothing.
--//--
no, it is not my fault for the condition of third world countries. It is their own fault for not living like a decent, moral human being. When people think of materialism they like to point at America or Western Europe, but those poor people you see in africa digging around in a mudhole hoping to find a diamond suffer just as much, if not more so, from materialism as anyone from a "rich" country.
It is not our fault that genocide occurs in Darfur or any other country, any more than its my fault O.J. Simpson is a murderer. I can only be responsible for the few relationships I have. It is not my job to police the world, nor is it the job of the U.S. to police the world every time some injustice is done, unless its something that threatens us or our allies specificly. We have enough problems in our own borders.
Social evolution works as long as no single bad apples can take the entire ship down with them, but we live in a world today where a lot of power is placed in a limited number of hands and the likelyhood of a single mistake causing global problems seems to be growing ... I'd love to see things more decentralized, but that doesn't appear to be happening anytime soon.
I would agree with your post. Contrary to the socialist and liberal agendas, statehood is a good thing that allows us to protect ourselves from the evils of other cultures, whether they be individuals or ideologies. One world government and centralized governing bodies such as the UN will lead to greater catastrophes than true statehood.
QUOTE
In a lot of cases the west is directly responsible for these undeveloped countries current states, so we should help them develop. Control is not needed in my opinion, and controlling populations is also not justified in my opinion.
How are we responsible? This whole liberal "spread the blame around" mentality is one of the things that is destroying the social fabric of western civilization.
In so many of these foriegn nations, American and European missionaries have been trying for generations to teach these people some simblance of morality and decency, even to the point of shipping them condoms by the ton and trying to educate them about disease and safe sex, and still they have a 30% aids rate. Who's fault is that? is it ours? No. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink.
If you want to blame yourself for the African Aids epidemic and other 3rd world problems that aren't our fault, well, you are free to do so.
Just don't blame me and the 1.5 billion people who's fault it isn't.
//--//
And this reminds me. My brother-in-law had to be hospitalized a while back on a short term basis due to a fainting problem he had caused by a blood pressure problem. He is a healthy, fit guy, so its not like he is lazy or anything. Anyway, he is required to pay the hospital over thirty thousand dollars for medical expenses. Since he makes too much money to get any sort of deferment or anything, they want the payment in far more than he and my sister can afford to pay per month. Now, turn on the news and see how American hospitals give free care to Iraqi kids and some boy monk, and do procedures that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars for free. this is unconstitutional and borderline treason, yet nobody seems to complain about it. They will literally give free care to the very people who want to kill us, but want to over charge American citizens. In fact, the reason Americans who make money pay so much is to pay for all the people who either can't pay or refuse to pay. I believe in social programs and medical programs for AMERICAN CITIZENS who actually need it, but this bit of giving expensive treatments to people who would just as well kill us is ridiculous, and giving huge amounts of money to foriegn nations with no return is unconstitutional, because it amounts to paying tribute to foreign nations, when we owe them nothing.
--//--
no, it is not my fault for the condition of third world countries. It is their own fault for not living like a decent, moral human being. When people think of materialism they like to point at America or Western Europe, but those poor people you see in africa digging around in a mudhole hoping to find a diamond suffer just as much, if not more so, from materialism as anyone from a "rich" country.
It is not our fault that genocide occurs in Darfur or any other country, any more than its my fault O.J. Simpson is a murderer. I can only be responsible for the few relationships I have. It is not my job to police the world, nor is it the job of the U.S. to police the world every time some injustice is done, unless its something that threatens us or our allies specificly. We have enough problems in our own borders.
I would add my list of the top ten problems facing society today, and of my first 5, all of them are moral issues and religious issues, and not something that politics will ever solve.
1) Subjective Truth movement- this, if it continues to go unchecked, will lead the world into a state of anarchy. Subjective truth has invaded every facet of intellectual discourse and as well has practically destroyed the legal system in America in the past few decades.
2) The New Age movement whereby people claim that all religions are the same or serve the same God. This goes hand in hand with #1 above, but the point is Truth is Truth and a Lie is a Lie. Two world views that contradict one another cannot both be true, so liberals and New Agers bug off.
3) Islam - Enough said. If you've ever read a few pages of the Koran you know what I'm talking about. It is not a "religion of peace and love", as our president claims. No, it is a religion of hatred and oppression.
4) False Prosperity Gospel propagated by 90% of the protestant so-called christian church. (I suppose I would be considered a protestant, though I am not affiliated with any church at the moment.) At any rate, this has made modern christianity the laughing stock of the world. No wonder there are so many atheists, when most of the professing "christians" have no clue what the Bible is even about.
5) The Roman Catholic Church, which has no scriptural basis whatsoever. While we can't exactly call a Muslim a hypocrite, since the Koran gives them permission to lie and murder in the name of Islam, one can most assuredly say that the RCC is nothing but a hypocrital beast.
6) Atheism
Since I'm talking about morality, this becomes an important topic. Where exactly do atheists get their morality? well, they get it from society. But the paradoxical thing is, Atheists have no logical reason to subscribe to any morality at all. If you truly do not believe in God, then you do not believe in anything other than subjective morality. if you believe in subjective morality, then you really don't believe in morality at all, as subjective morality changes from person to person. Atheism and Subjective morality go hand in hand, though Atheism is on the opposite spectrum from the New Age movement, yet it is morally the same: an attempt to say that morality doesn't matter, truth doesn't matter, everyone just do whatever you feel like doing, etc.
If there is no God, then morality is an illusion, and laws are pure hypocrissy. If anyone wants to debate this topic, feel free to respond.
7) The naive belief that "democracy" is somehow "good" in and of itself.
Americans somehow thing we are a "good" nation simply because we are a "democracy"(actually we are a democratic Republic, but that's another matter.) But democracy is just a system of government. Democracy is not inherently "good". Democracy is only as good as the people who participate. If you have two wolves and a lamb in a democracy, the two wolves vote to have lunch, and the lamb is screwed. So then we see than "democracy" is not the solution in Iraq. You can't turn Iraq or Iran into a democracy and expect their problems, or for that matter, our problems with their policy, to just go away, because the people there have been brainwashed for generations with false ideology of hating America and Israel, based on ISLAM. Ok, so you make a democracy where almost everyone is a Muslim and believes america and Israel are the "great satan" so now they all vote unanimously to continue doing the same old thing: opposing America and Israel...Evil people will continue to be evil no matter what government system they subscribe to.
Dont be fooled, America has its Kings, Lords, Dukes, Emperors, Dictators, etc. They just go by other names: CEO, President, Senator, British Petroleum, EXXon, Microsoft, AT&T, etc, all under the guise of "democracy".
Am I anti-American? Absolutely not. All I'm saying is democracy without a moral context means nothing. When the majority is evil, or when certain groups somehow steal and wheel and deal their way into a political or economic advantage, then "democracy" becomes an instrument of evil.
8) Buying on credit
Seriously, does anyone actually pay for anything any more? Just buy it on credit, then when you can't afford to pay your bills, file bankruptcy. Seems to be what individuals do, and it seems to be what local, state, and federal governments have in mind too. Lets all just print some more paper money and take out a few more loans, we'll be fine.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
NOT!!
9) Criminal Justice System
Hey, here's a new idea! How about, when someone breaks a law, they actually go to jail/prison, and actually live in a penal environment while in there, instead of living better than many law abiding citizens. How about actually sentence some of those people who are on death row. How about actually enforce the life sentences of lifers, instead of letting them out on parole. If there was actually a meaningful penalty for crime, some people wouldn't do it as much. If police didn't get put on trial for doing their jobs, they might not be afraid to do their job more properly.
And no, the founding fathers did not consider hanging, guillotine, or firing squad as "cruel and unusual punishment". This whole bit of reinterpreting the law every time a case comes to trial is ridiculous. How about someone actually read a history book and look at what the constitution says in its historical context?
When a murderer or rapist is found guilty and there is sufficient evidence and sufficient level of assurance that there is no possibility of a wrong verdict, then the *** should be killed. Cruel and unusual? But for who? The criminal? Oh wait, didn't THEY break the law by murdering, raping, robbing, etc? Who's on trial here? the court? or the criminal? Why should everyone else have to pay for the sucker's appeal, or pay for his living for 15 or 20 years while they debate what to do with him? If he/she is guilty, take him out back and put a bullet through his head and be done with it.
10) Outsourcing of job market, especially in the IT sector.
Treason: Period.
1) Subjective Truth movement- this, if it continues to go unchecked, will lead the world into a state of anarchy. Subjective truth has invaded every facet of intellectual discourse and as well has practically destroyed the legal system in America in the past few decades.
2) The New Age movement whereby people claim that all religions are the same or serve the same God. This goes hand in hand with #1 above, but the point is Truth is Truth and a Lie is a Lie. Two world views that contradict one another cannot both be true, so liberals and New Agers bug off.
3) Islam - Enough said. If you've ever read a few pages of the Koran you know what I'm talking about. It is not a "religion of peace and love", as our president claims. No, it is a religion of hatred and oppression.
4) False Prosperity Gospel propagated by 90% of the protestant so-called christian church. (I suppose I would be considered a protestant, though I am not affiliated with any church at the moment.) At any rate, this has made modern christianity the laughing stock of the world. No wonder there are so many atheists, when most of the professing "christians" have no clue what the Bible is even about.
5) The Roman Catholic Church, which has no scriptural basis whatsoever. While we can't exactly call a Muslim a hypocrite, since the Koran gives them permission to lie and murder in the name of Islam, one can most assuredly say that the RCC is nothing but a hypocrital beast.
6) Atheism
Since I'm talking about morality, this becomes an important topic. Where exactly do atheists get their morality? well, they get it from society. But the paradoxical thing is, Atheists have no logical reason to subscribe to any morality at all. If you truly do not believe in God, then you do not believe in anything other than subjective morality. if you believe in subjective morality, then you really don't believe in morality at all, as subjective morality changes from person to person. Atheism and Subjective morality go hand in hand, though Atheism is on the opposite spectrum from the New Age movement, yet it is morally the same: an attempt to say that morality doesn't matter, truth doesn't matter, everyone just do whatever you feel like doing, etc.
If there is no God, then morality is an illusion, and laws are pure hypocrissy. If anyone wants to debate this topic, feel free to respond.
7) The naive belief that "democracy" is somehow "good" in and of itself.
Americans somehow thing we are a "good" nation simply because we are a "democracy"(actually we are a democratic Republic, but that's another matter.) But democracy is just a system of government. Democracy is not inherently "good". Democracy is only as good as the people who participate. If you have two wolves and a lamb in a democracy, the two wolves vote to have lunch, and the lamb is screwed. So then we see than "democracy" is not the solution in Iraq. You can't turn Iraq or Iran into a democracy and expect their problems, or for that matter, our problems with their policy, to just go away, because the people there have been brainwashed for generations with false ideology of hating America and Israel, based on ISLAM. Ok, so you make a democracy where almost everyone is a Muslim and believes america and Israel are the "great satan" so now they all vote unanimously to continue doing the same old thing: opposing America and Israel...Evil people will continue to be evil no matter what government system they subscribe to.
Dont be fooled, America has its Kings, Lords, Dukes, Emperors, Dictators, etc. They just go by other names: CEO, President, Senator, British Petroleum, EXXon, Microsoft, AT&T, etc, all under the guise of "democracy".
Am I anti-American? Absolutely not. All I'm saying is democracy without a moral context means nothing. When the majority is evil, or when certain groups somehow steal and wheel and deal their way into a political or economic advantage, then "democracy" becomes an instrument of evil.
8) Buying on credit
Seriously, does anyone actually pay for anything any more? Just buy it on credit, then when you can't afford to pay your bills, file bankruptcy. Seems to be what individuals do, and it seems to be what local, state, and federal governments have in mind too. Lets all just print some more paper money and take out a few more loans, we'll be fine.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
NOT!!
9) Criminal Justice System
Hey, here's a new idea! How about, when someone breaks a law, they actually go to jail/prison, and actually live in a penal environment while in there, instead of living better than many law abiding citizens. How about actually sentence some of those people who are on death row. How about actually enforce the life sentences of lifers, instead of letting them out on parole. If there was actually a meaningful penalty for crime, some people wouldn't do it as much. If police didn't get put on trial for doing their jobs, they might not be afraid to do their job more properly.
And no, the founding fathers did not consider hanging, guillotine, or firing squad as "cruel and unusual punishment". This whole bit of reinterpreting the law every time a case comes to trial is ridiculous. How about someone actually read a history book and look at what the constitution says in its historical context?
When a murderer or rapist is found guilty and there is sufficient evidence and sufficient level of assurance that there is no possibility of a wrong verdict, then the *** should be killed. Cruel and unusual? But for who? The criminal? Oh wait, didn't THEY break the law by murdering, raping, robbing, etc? Who's on trial here? the court? or the criminal? Why should everyone else have to pay for the sucker's appeal, or pay for his living for 15 or 20 years while they debate what to do with him? If he/she is guilty, take him out back and put a bullet through his head and be done with it.
10) Outsourcing of job market, especially in the IT sector.
Treason: Period.
QUOTE
There are different ways to contribute to society.
There certainly are. And if you think you are helping, then you most probably are.
I remember and old FOCUS magazine had the top ten reasons civilisation would come to an end, all the usual war, disease, end of all energy in the Universe.
The one that really intruiged me was..everyone not being bothered to live anymore.
I think that's the most likely way out, as any society gets more comfortable and educated the birth rate drops and the same will happen to whole world.
We will die out from boredom of being alive, a sort of mass depression, it has started allready, we aren't special, we won't go to heaven, the Universe doesn't give a sh*t about us, we are just the end game of selected replication..why bother?
Are young feeling it too?
The one that really intruiged me was..everyone not being bothered to live anymore.
I think that's the most likely way out, as any society gets more comfortable and educated the birth rate drops and the same will happen to whole world.
We will die out from boredom of being alive, a sort of mass depression, it has started allready, we aren't special, we won't go to heaven, the Universe doesn't give a sh*t about us, we are just the end game of selected replication..why bother?
Are young feeling it too?
That's just natural selection.
The people who want to stay alive will do so.
The people who want to stay alive will do so.
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