To add comments or start new threads please go to the full version of: peroxide based liquid explosive detection
PhysForum Science, Physics and Technology Discussion Forums > Biology, Chemistry, Medicine, Other Sciences > Other Sciences

rajan
I'm looking for some starting-out information on detection of peroxide based explosives (like the ones brutally used previously against civilians). everything on the internet is too basic and everything on Web Of Science is too far from applications. specific questions you may have answers to:

1. what are the forms of these explosives? i wouldn't think they're hydrogen peroxides, so what are they?

2. how is detection possible spectroscopically/instrumentation-wise? i'm not talking like a catalase assay, i think that would be horribly inefficient in an airport line. spectroscopists? why wouldn't GC-MS work? I don't think a peroxide would do very well in either one of these (probably destroy the GC column and get obliterated in the MS), but do you know why/can you give me a link to a paper?

3. all explosions are radical reactions... is this true or false. one of my classmates told me this, but i don't see how it could be true.

please, no conspiracy theories, i'm just interested in the science behind these things.
Confused2
Some stuff here..
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...tntsniffer.html
-C2.
MDT
Hydrogen peroxide is essentially water with weakly bounded oxygen. It is H2O2 instead of H2O. It readily breaks down to give off oxygen. This allows combustion or explosions to occur without much air, since the peroxide supplies the needed oxygen. If peroxide is mixed with certain compounds, all the oxygen needed is stored in the liquid solution. One only needs to trigger the peroxide to quickly release the oxygen. Chain reactions, like explosion can be break down the peroxide, leading to self feeding explosions.

Low concentration solutions of peroxide is often used to treat minor injuries and can be used as an oral rinse. It is sort of a cool experiment. If one has a minor cut, pour some store bought peroxide on it. The open tissue wll act like a catalyst causing the oxygen to be released. The visual result is a foaming action caused by the rapid release of oxygen bubbles. If one did this each day, eventully, the foaming action will decrease and then stop upon contact with cut. The catalytic action of the cut lowers and then stops upon healing.
Dennis
Commercially available hydrogen peroxide is only about 4% peroxide the rest is common old water, peroxide at 90%+ makes ideal rocket fuel. Pure peroxide will cause most metals and many salts to combust and some very rapidly.

All chemicals give off some emissions look up Nitrous Oxide detectors on Google or try www.wpi-europe they sell them. Another science forum I visit had a discussion about this type of thing but the discussion became too involved and they were all but passing around instructions how to make these explosives, something I think we should avoid.
user999
QUOTE (rajan+Aug 12 2006, 07:55 PM)
I'm looking for some starting-out information on detection of peroxide based explosives (like the ones brutally used previously against civilians). everything on the internet is too basic and everything on Web Of Science is too far from applications. specific questions you may have answers to:

1. what are the forms of these explosives? i wouldn't think they're hydrogen peroxides, so what are they?

2. how is detection possible spectroscopically/instrumentation-wise? i'm not talking like a catalase assay, i think that would be horribly inefficient in an airport line. spectroscopists? why wouldn't GC-MS work? I don't think a peroxide would do very well in either one of these (probably destroy the GC column and get obliterated in the MS), but do you know why/can you give me a link to a paper?

3. all explosions are radical reactions... is this true or false. one of my classmates told me this, but i don't see how it could be true.

please, no conspiracy theories, i'm just interested in the science behind these things.

Take a look at GE manufacturer explosive detection devices like vaportracer and itemizer. I can send you shematics on detection process if it helps.

Enthalpy
Hi everybody! Some bits and pieces, not very useful:

Peroxides are more general than hydrogen peroxide.
Have a look at the Handbook of Chemistry and Physics, at Safety section.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acetone_peroxide is your basic target.

Hydrogen peroxide is not just an oxygen supplier. The molecule itself is unstable, meaning that the decomposition in water and oxygen provides heat. Over 70% peroxide among water, this heat is enough to vaporize the liquid, hence boom - no fuel needed. However, it makes a bad rocket fuel: Very limited specific impulse, but very dangerous.

Detecting them: Do they all have some vapour pressure? Or at least, the ones used in explosives? Maybe you could adapt a method that detects ozone in minute quantity: Mix a di-ene with the air, observe faint light emission at room temperature.

Remember that packaging can make explosives undetectable by smell nor spectrum.
coae
I have found over the internet the ATSC LTD website. Which is an explosives detector.
What do you think about that?
Capracus
http://www.sciencedaily.com/videos/2008/07...g_out_bombs.htm
PhysOrg scientific forums are totally dedicated to science, physics, and technology. Besides topical forums such as nanotechnology, quantum physics, silicon and III-V technology, applied physics, materials, space and others, you can also join our news and publications discussions. We also provide an off-topic forum category. If you need specific help on a scientific problem or have a question related to physics or technology, visit the PhysOrg Forums. Here you’ll find experts from various fields online every day.
To quit out of "lo-fi" mode and return to the regular forums, please click here.