http://www.physorg.com/news106493426.html
Another nail in the creationists coffin.
Amazing, proteins evolving for future structures is ANTICIPATION which denotes a form of intelligence. But what a form of intelligence! Can the effects of slow motion, long term time based intelligence be detected at the atomic level? And we're misnaming it evolution?
goddog
goddog
This article blew my mind .... isn't this sort of thing a KO punch to creationists ?
I don't know why I'm feeding the troll, but..........For crying out loud, learn to read goddog. How on Earth did you get the idea that this protein was changing in "anticipation" of a future state. All the researchers did was trace back how many mutations it might take to reach the current state from an ancestral state. Period. That the mutations apparently happened to grease the wheels for future mutations to effect change means just that and nothing else.
QUOTE (goddog+Aug 17 2007, 10:17 AM)
Amazing, proteins evolving for future structures is ANTICIPATION which denotes a form of intelligence. But what a form of intelligence! Can the effects of slow motion, long term time based intelligence be detected at the atomic level? And we're misnaming it evolution?
goddog
Or, there's the logical conclusion that the other mutations occured as well, but only those that didn't negate the use of the hormone entirely survived.
goddog
Or, there's the logical conclusion that the other mutations occured as well, but only those that didn't negate the use of the hormone entirely survived.
QUOTE (goddog+Aug 16 2007, 05:17 PM)
Amazing, proteins evolving for future structures is ANTICIPATION which denotes a form of intelligence. But what a form of intelligence! Can the effects of slow motion, long term time based intelligence be detected at the atomic level? And we're misnaming it evolution?
goddog
A simple protein couldn't possibly know what to evolve itself to. How could it have intelligence unless it's a supernatural being known as God?
goddog
A simple protein couldn't possibly know what to evolve itself to. How could it have intelligence unless it's a supernatural being known as God?
555Joshua, interesting nick. Reminds me of 555 timer chip, are you into electronics?
The comment I made was a result of observations myself and I'm sure others have made over time with regard to animal and insect life.
Example is Monarch and Viceroy butterflies. It is a known fact that predators will not eat Monarch's because of their foul taste, however Viceroy's (which are smaller) have no such taste (defense) and are very edible. Now the question is how did the Viceroy come to look (mimic) the colors and wing pattern of the Monarch, and adopt its looks to fool predators? One more example, again butterflies is a species in South America that was discovered to (when it's wings where painted with a different color and pattern) adopt that same color / pattern within just one generation!
So just what is DNA / RNA, really? And to end any confusion here, proteins are a programmable universal building block of every life form on our planet. Programmable as in (prionic contagion a.k.a. mad cow disease). DNA / RNA and proteins are interlinked within the living matrix of our planet.
So is DNA / RNA really being misidentified as a natural intelligent of its own accord via evolution? Or is DNA / RNA itself, a very ancient life form that gave up its own independence long ago to become a variety of mobile, colony of various life forms from humans to virus? Thats why I made the statement I made.
goddog
The comment I made was a result of observations myself and I'm sure others have made over time with regard to animal and insect life.
Example is Monarch and Viceroy butterflies. It is a known fact that predators will not eat Monarch's because of their foul taste, however Viceroy's (which are smaller) have no such taste (defense) and are very edible. Now the question is how did the Viceroy come to look (mimic) the colors and wing pattern of the Monarch, and adopt its looks to fool predators? One more example, again butterflies is a species in South America that was discovered to (when it's wings where painted with a different color and pattern) adopt that same color / pattern within just one generation!
So just what is DNA / RNA, really? And to end any confusion here, proteins are a programmable universal building block of every life form on our planet. Programmable as in (prionic contagion a.k.a. mad cow disease). DNA / RNA and proteins are interlinked within the living matrix of our planet.
So is DNA / RNA really being misidentified as a natural intelligent of its own accord via evolution? Or is DNA / RNA itself, a very ancient life form that gave up its own independence long ago to become a variety of mobile, colony of various life forms from humans to virus? Thats why I made the statement I made.
goddog
QUOTE (Hodgepodge+Aug 17 2007, 05:47 AM)
I don't know why I'm feeding the troll, but..........For crying out loud, learn to read goddog. How on Earth did you get the idea that this protein was changing in "anticipation" of a future state. All the researchers did was trace back how many mutations it might take to reach the current state from an ancestral state. Period. That the mutations apparently happened to grease the wheels for future mutations to effect change means just that and nothing else.
HodgePodge.... only my mother can call me "a troll", but all kidding aside. I did read the article several times just to make sure I got the import of what was being written.
The anticipation quote is mine, even troll's have ideas from time to time.
But realistically speaking if you run an effect forwards or backwards and you get the same results, can one not use ANTICIPATION in its correct form?
It reminds me of the time when we where looking at a disk spinning counterclockwise.
One student looked at the disk and stated "if we looked at it from the bottom, it would be spinning clockwise". I told him he was confusing reality with "mirror images" and to prove my point I asked a girl to give me her compact, where upon I opened its mirror up and told the student to look at the disk using the mirror. He understood immediate his mistaken logic.
Troll... I mean goddog.
HodgePodge.... only my mother can call me "a troll", but all kidding aside. I did read the article several times just to make sure I got the import of what was being written.
The anticipation quote is mine, even troll's have ideas from time to time.
But realistically speaking if you run an effect forwards or backwards and you get the same results, can one not use ANTICIPATION in its correct form?
It reminds me of the time when we where looking at a disk spinning counterclockwise.
One student looked at the disk and stated "if we looked at it from the bottom, it would be spinning clockwise". I told him he was confusing reality with "mirror images" and to prove my point I asked a girl to give me her compact, where upon I opened its mirror up and told the student to look at the disk using the mirror. He understood immediate his mistaken logic.
Troll... I mean goddog.
None of this has anything to do with creation. The question of creation is only relevant to the source of all things.
Did the universe and all the attributes come about by magic or is there a source for everything. This source must include intelligence and the ability to create. Anything that is the source for all the attributes of the universe is by definition, God.
The very fact that evolution follows the basic laws of creation should give any thinking person a clue.
Did the universe and all the attributes come about by magic or is there a source for everything. This source must include intelligence and the ability to create. Anything that is the source for all the attributes of the universe is by definition, God.
The very fact that evolution follows the basic laws of creation should give any thinking person a clue.
tlocity..... the universe is a very big place. It would be more than a little arrogant of us to assume we and we alone "know" the basic laws of creation. Sometimes some of us, and yes me too, have been confused by a phenomenon that looks like magic or god but in fact can be explained within human terms through math and or experimentation.
I personally cater to being a "deist" and as such shun all major religions due to their man made origins.
Just remember that no one knows everything thats possible to know. That blind faith is like walking into a dark room without lights, you never know what you'll stumble across.
goddog
I personally cater to being a "deist" and as such shun all major religions due to their man made origins.
Just remember that no one knows everything thats possible to know. That blind faith is like walking into a dark room without lights, you never know what you'll stumble across.
goddog
Trippy... you could very well have your finger on the effect. And yes there can be many mutations that side branched and have been missed. We are only beginning to understand what life here really encompasses. I'm personally looking forward "eagerly" to future developments on this subject.
goddog
goddog
QUOTE (goddog+Aug 19 2007, 03:21 PM)
555Joshua, interesting nick. Reminds me of 555 timer chip, are you into electronics?
The comment I made was a result of observations myself and I'm sure others have made over time with regard to animal and insect life.
Example is Monarch and Viceroy butterflies. It is a known fact that predators will not eat Monarch's because of their foul taste, however Viceroy's (which are smaller) have no such taste (defense) and are very edible. Now the question is how did the Viceroy come to look (mimic) the colors and wing pattern of the Monarch, and adopt its looks to fool predators? One more example, again butterflies is a species in South America that was discovered to (when it's wings where painted with a different color and pattern) adopt that same color / pattern within just one generation!
So just what is DNA / RNA, really? And to end any confusion here, proteins are a programmable universal building block of every life form on our planet. Programmable as in (prionic contagion a.k.a. mad cow disease). DNA / RNA and proteins are interlinked within the living matrix of our planet.
So is DNA / RNA really being misidentified as a natural intelligent of its own accord via evolution? Or is DNA / RNA itself, a very ancient life form that gave up its own independence long ago to become a variety of mobile, colony of various life forms from humans to virus? Thats why I made the statement I made.
goddog
Microchips?
Oh, know. 555 is a popular first three digit segment of a phone number. That's why. 
The reason the tasty butterfly looks like the nasty butterfly is because the butterflies that looked like the nasty ones lived to breed, while the tasty butterflies that looked tasty, died. Thus, ending they're tasty family tree. That's evolution. What I was referring to was DNA having the ability to think, without thought process, which is impossible. If DNA could think I could then, theoretically carry out a conversation with my own. Since I can not, I can only come to the conclusion that it is thoughtless. Either that or it's ignoring me.
The comment I made was a result of observations myself and I'm sure others have made over time with regard to animal and insect life.
Example is Monarch and Viceroy butterflies. It is a known fact that predators will not eat Monarch's because of their foul taste, however Viceroy's (which are smaller) have no such taste (defense) and are very edible. Now the question is how did the Viceroy come to look (mimic) the colors and wing pattern of the Monarch, and adopt its looks to fool predators? One more example, again butterflies is a species in South America that was discovered to (when it's wings where painted with a different color and pattern) adopt that same color / pattern within just one generation!
So just what is DNA / RNA, really? And to end any confusion here, proteins are a programmable universal building block of every life form on our planet. Programmable as in (prionic contagion a.k.a. mad cow disease). DNA / RNA and proteins are interlinked within the living matrix of our planet.
So is DNA / RNA really being misidentified as a natural intelligent of its own accord via evolution? Or is DNA / RNA itself, a very ancient life form that gave up its own independence long ago to become a variety of mobile, colony of various life forms from humans to virus? Thats why I made the statement I made.
goddog
Microchips?
Oh, know. 555 is a popular first three digit segment of a phone number. That's why. The reason the tasty butterfly looks like the nasty butterfly is because the butterflies that looked like the nasty ones lived to breed, while the tasty butterflies that looked tasty, died. Thus, ending they're tasty family tree. That's evolution. What I was referring to was DNA having the ability to think, without thought process, which is impossible. If DNA could think I could then, theoretically carry out a conversation with my own. Since I can not, I can only come to the conclusion that it is thoughtless. Either that or it's ignoring me.
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