Good Elf
4th March 2006 - 01:14 AM
Hi All,
I think the ability of Bats to navigate with such speed agility and accuracy is beyond what physics would normally believe. I saw a Discovery program which said that bats routinely navigate through a grid of very fine wires at speed in the dark using echolocation.
Bat sonar more accurate than thought – by three times 1998This is very old information and there is more to the story below. The bats brain is processing a vast amount of data yet the ability of a bats brain is limited "technically" to about 400 computations per second being a biological system. The fine wires dimensions and maths theory indicate the need for a "superior" processing ability. This suggests that bats brains are able to cut through the Gordian Knot of information congestion and do upwards of 3 Million operations per second by some process yet unknown. I assume they can "walk and chew gum at the same time" as well. I have included this article as something related for you all to think about...
Talk Show - Laura Lee on BatsQUOTE (Conversation For Exploration: Laura Lee+)
Bat Sonar And Anti-Submarine WarfareDolphins do it. Big brown bats do it. And sometime soon, the Office of Naval Research hopes its researchers will be able to do it too. Echolocation, that is, and turning the processing of such signals into a system that will enable us to mimic a flying bat’s ability to detect and classify a flying beetle in three dimensions at thirty feet.
ONR’s Bio-Sonar program supports the bat research of Brown University neuroscientist, Jim Simmons. Bats use sonar to find food and avoid obstacles much the way our military sonar systems would like to find and detect submarines and mines. “Bats make sounds, listen to echoes, and then see objects,” notes Simmons. “We want to know what the neurons in the bat's auditory system are doing to process the echoes that allows their brains to ‘see’ an image. We now know that bats have a method of doing synthetic aperture sonar while flying that not only determines the distance and direction of all the objects in a scene, but also reconstructs one specific object’s shape. What’s really incredible is that they can do both simultaneously.”
In Simmons' experiments, the bats are trained to differentiate sounds with the time separation of those sounds shortened to test the bats' response.
“The bats humor us,” says Simmons. “They get mealworms if they behave.”
A major goal of ONR’s bio-sonar research program is to duplicate the ability to differentiate between two echoes that arrive at almost the same time. Today’s electronic sonar processing can differentiate between echoes about 12 millionths of a second apart. Bats have it down to 2 to 3 millionths of a second. Being able to separate such sounds means that bats can tell the difference between objects and shapes that are separated by only about the width of a human hair.
“ONR would like to get naval sonars, both in listening and in processing the return information, a bit more, well, bat-like,” notes ONR’s Harold Hawkins.
Source: Office Of Naval Research (
http://www.onr.navy.mil)This is fascinating stuff and it has great philosophical implications for puny organic systems such as ourselves if only we could use these processes to enhance our cognitive skills. It would be worth more than a "couple of mealworms" to us if we could.
Cheers
guessed
10th March 2006 - 01:33 PM
The 'speed' of thought is instantanious, therefore infinite, just like its true origin.
Your 'dreams' connect you to all the other possibilities in the Infinite.
With your 'science', you are about to 'prove' it to yourselves.
Your infinite aspect is REAL.
You have already given it many names.
Soon, you will see that your mind is not a 'toy'.
When you see this, you will force yourselves to 'grow up'.
Your 'theories' have no meaning.
Your 'theories' are merely vague attempts to connect to reality.
Reality will connect to you, when you let it.
Go to sleep now, and when you awake you will remember your connection.
You have spoken to yourselves.
Robohogg
15th March 2006 - 01:15 PM
Wow !! Interesting. I think I see what "guest_wallace f" is trying to say, it's just, he/she talks in circles, so that by the time you've finished reading the post..you're not sure which particular part is the point. It's not impossible for this all to be a creation of a mind, whether it's mine, yours, the collective unconscious, God, Buddha, Explorer-Builder K'gonzaghee from Palain IV, The Machine, etc. However, unfortunately, I have to agree with the "scientific" point of view in that if it's "your" theory, YOU have to prove it. problem I struggle with is that how can you use the tools that reality has given you, to evaluate the reality that has given them to you. Almost akin to using things you find in your dreams to find out if you're dreaming, nothing in your dream has the power to go "outside" the dream and dissect/examine it to a more accurate frame of reference. How can you prove that God exists ?? How can you prove that he does not ? If He/She /It IS an omnipotent being, then anything you do, or attempt to do has already been forseen, or is instantaneously forseen by relevant deity when neccessary, and depending upon the deity's motives, any move of yours can be be circumvented, or forestalled, hindered or diverted. So..good luck trying to outhink God.
However (apologies for the long post) I do believe that everyone has their own set of beliefs, and if you feel you need to prove them, go right ahead. I believe that there is more to life than what we can see/taste/touch etc. More to life than we can identify with our reason. I can't prove it, but I will attempt to. And if I fail, well, will you be bothered ?? For you have your own beliefs. And that is how it should be. Well, unless you believe it is ok to go out and murder, rape, kill, defile, etc..Because I think it is WRONG to harm others, and you can view that as morally wrong, or just wrong because it's not a productive way for a society reliant on co-operation for survival. The End.
Knot of this world
15th March 2006 - 11:20 PM
QUOTE (Robohogg+Mar 15 2006, 01:15 PM)
It's not impossible for this all to be a creation of a mind...
How about if we are just evolved aspects of One Universal Mind, trying to understand itself? That would unify just about everything, wouldn't it?
S.
Matador
10th January 2012 - 03:12 AM
Mekigal
31st July 2012 - 08:39 PM
ordering sets does. .
anyway that was interesting . If you think of the origin of a thought as a starting place and the conclusion or destination being your mind right now for it to be accurate seems to me you have to add all the time it took to get to your brain independent of how long it took to transverse your gray matter .
So to you it transverses the universe of time it self but really it just transverses the distance of your brain + the time others prepared the package for delivery , which could be millions or even billions of years of different entities on down through the ages refining and deleting bits and pieces of the information .
I still call it stacking.
It don't seem like stacking to the individual because of the hoarding instinct . You have the sensation that the thoughts are your own . When in fact they are replicas of past thoughts reconfigured in your brain . Which adds to the delusion that you do have your own thoughts. Even if you do something that resembles a new thought it really is not but rather a natural progression of thought instead . Reconfigured by natural processes as the next reorganization in the advancement of ever changing circumstances.
Adaption as to keep up with the demands of exploitation.
Hoarders all the way
james067
7th November 2012 - 11:16 AM
thought is that which came from ur mind and it will take nanaseconds..
Plotus
27th March 2013 - 02:04 AM
QUOTE (fivedoughnut+Dec 1 2005, 11:24 PM)
Speed.......around 0.6 milliseconds/average human mind.
I imagine you mean the speed synapsis function at ie. distance traveled. Could that be the 'initiation to the manifestation of thought' rather than the distance thought can travel. imagination/thought takes me from this keyboard to the surface of pluto in my mind nearly instantly, or rather at this 0.6 milliseconds? from the time i imagine it till it manifest in my mind........ just my food for thought.
Robittybob1
27th March 2013 - 02:21 AM
QUOTE (Plotus+Mar 27 2013, 02:04 AM)
I imagine you mean the speed synapsis function at ie. distance traveled. Could that be the 'initiation to the manifestation of thought' rather than the distance thought can travel. imagination/thought takes me from this keyboard to the surface of pluto in my mind nearly instantly, or rather at this 0.6 milliseconds? from the time i imagine it till it manifest in my mind........ just my food for thought.
The thought about the surface of Pluto was a preconceived thought. You had already worked out a picture of Pluto before you thought of using it as an example. So your thought didn't go to the surface of Pluto but just to another area of your relatively small brain which should have taken virtually no time at all to traverse.
Mekigal
27th March 2013 - 05:31 AM
QUOTE (Robittybob1+Mar 27 2013, 02:21 AM)
The thought about the surface of Pluto was a preconceived thought. You had already worked out a picture of Pluto before you thought of using it as an example. So your thought didn't go to the surface of Pluto but just to another area of your relatively small brain which should have taken virtually no time at all to traverse.
why did you do that ? What did he do to you ? You said he had a small brain ? Rpenner You are one mean irritable dude Rob . Rude thing to say . I knew you where mean
Robittybob1
27th March 2013 - 05:41 AM
QUOTE (Mekigal+Mar 27 2013, 05:31 AM)
why did you do that ? What did he do to you ? You said he had a small brain ? Rpenner You are one mean irritable dude Rob . Rude thing to say . I knew you where mean
I thought you might be affected by me saying that. Look he was trying to say his mind extends all the way to Pluto, so very truthfully the dimensions of a human brain in comparison is extreme minuscule to say the very least.
And that is what I was saying, but the likes of you would naturally read it the wrong way and accuse me falsely of being rude.
Could you not see the funny side to that? To me it was as funny as.
Mekigal
27th March 2013 - 05:44 AM
QUOTE (Robittybob1+Mar 27 2013, 05:41 AM)
I thought you might be affected by me saying that. Look he was trying to say his mind extends all the way to Pluto, so very truthfully the dimensions of a human brain in comparison is extreme minuscule to say the very least.
And that is what I was saying, but the likes of you would naturally read it the wrong way and accuse me falsely of being rude.
Could you not see the funny side to that? To me it was as funny as.
funny as a one armed wall paper hanger cause you are an evil Jesus lover . Say it < You are an Evil Jesus lover so they know
Robittybob1
27th March 2013 - 06:01 AM
QUOTE (Mekigal+Mar 27 2013, 05:44 AM)
funny as a one armed wall paper hanger cause you are an evil Jesus lover . Say it < You are an Evil Jesus lover so they know
I don't find seeing a person with a disability funny? I would much prefer to be an "an Evil Jesus lover" than find that funny.
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