I know you read everything I post. Nice to see you are still stalking me even though you are banned from the forum for threatening people and such.
Since our recently departed Mr. Robin Parsons is still visiting the site and was mentioned in recent threads, I’d thought I’d let anyone who was threatened by, harassed by or insulted by Robin know that he is commenting about what transpired and transpires here on his blog.
More importantly, he is blogging about people he had problems with on this forum. He has in fact made more accusations about the moderators here at Physorg and more veiled legal threats.
Link
QUOTE
That was what got me to 80% warning level ~ and shortly thereafter the last warning that removed me from their milieu, something that several of the members therein had expressed a desire to have done - remove me...that too makes the People at Physorg.com (Moderators ~ Admins ~ et al) look complicit in the entire affair.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| That was what got me to 80% warning level ~ and shortly thereafter the last warning that removed me from their milieu, something that several of the members therein had expressed a desire to have done - remove me...that too makes the People at Physorg.com (Moderators ~ Admins ~ et al) look complicit in the entire affair. |
When will it end?? (should (I) sue?? know a good lawyer for such things??)
Check out the previous posts made on his blog since he was banned from Physorg.
Does Robin not have a picture of a poster here and a child of that poster? Did he not declare that he was going to keep it for his own personal and private purposes?
Well, considering he is now stalking people from this forum since he was banned, I think he has gotten a bit more dangerous.
Instead of creating another account, he seems content with stalking from his blog.
This is a violation of the TOS for Yahoo accounts, specifically parts:
QUOTE
a. upload, post, email, transmit or otherwise make available any Content that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortious, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's privacy, hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable;
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| a. upload, post, email, transmit or otherwise make available any Content that is unlawful, harmful, threatening, abusive, harassing, tortious, defamatory, vulgar, obscene, libelous, invasive of another's privacy, hateful, or racially, ethnically or otherwise objectionable; |
b. harm minors in any way;
QUOTE
m."stalk" or otherwise harass another; and/or
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| m."stalk" or otherwise harass another; and/or |
n. collect or store personal data about other users in connection with the prohibited conduct and activities set forth in paragraphs a through m above.
Of course, you could always report this abuse , but that would only be if you think you have been wronged or threatened by his actions.
At the very least, let us be kind and occasionally say “Hi” to Robin when we post.
In fact, I would ask anyone replying to this thread to preface their replies with “Hi, Robin” just so he doesn’t feel missed.
I'll say hi as well:
Hi Robin! How's the child porn business going? I hear your making loads of cash.
All the best,
Gehn
Hi Robin! How's the child porn business going? I hear your making loads of cash.
All the best,
Gehn
Hi Robin,
I was on holiday all last week and you can't believe my delight to get back and see that you'd reached 100% warn level!
Happy blogging bozo
I was on holiday all last week and you can't believe my delight to get back and see that you'd reached 100% warn level!
Happy blogging bozo
Hi Sir Robin,
Wow. I knew he had a bit of a delusional, paranoid, messianic self-absorption issue, but I never knew it was sooo bad. He really and truly needs professional attention. (I) know this may become a law suit towards me (and possibly resulting in UN sanctions against me), but he is down right crackers. Wow.
I don't know how else to say it but, wow.
Thanks for the heads up, guys. I'll try to stay at least 3 international borders away from (him) at all times.
Peace,
Ron
Wow. I knew he had a bit of a delusional, paranoid, messianic self-absorption issue, but I never knew it was sooo bad. He really and truly needs professional attention. (I) know this may become a law suit towards me (and possibly resulting in UN sanctions against me), but he is down right crackers. Wow.
I don't know how else to say it but, wow.
Thanks for the heads up, guys. I'll try to stay at least 3 international borders away from (him) at all times.
Peace,
Ron
Rejecting and making fun of this person is the easy option. In relation to our
understanding of One Love, cases such as his are great measures for us.
understanding of One Love, cases such as his are great measures for us.
Robin 
?
?
Hi Robin!
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 10:22 AM)
Rejecting and making fun of this person is the easy option. In relation to our
understanding of One Love, cases such as his are great measures for us.
One does not embrace the intentionally foolish, the charlatan or the liar. Robin has been proven to be a liar as illustrated by the convoluted tall tale of a conspiracy against him from two governments, two politicians and two women who, as he claims, he spurned.
You are free to embrace such lunacy if you like.
Just an FYI. I did contact the Canadian SC and asked for information pertaining to contacting Ms. Julie Therrien.
This was the contact that Mr. Robin Parsons claimed took his “revolutionary” idea that was used in the John Robin Sharpe case #27376 he never received credit for and was therefore one of the conspirators against him.
I am shocked to report that they have yet to reply.
Even a web search reveals no such a person involved with the CSC as he claimed.
The conspiracy must be vast!
Either that or Mr. Robin Parsons has been shown to have lied yet again.
At best, she was probably a law clerk that no longer works there and not a lawyer as Mr. Robin Parson claimed.
understanding of One Love, cases such as his are great measures for us.
One does not embrace the intentionally foolish, the charlatan or the liar. Robin has been proven to be a liar as illustrated by the convoluted tall tale of a conspiracy against him from two governments, two politicians and two women who, as he claims, he spurned.
You are free to embrace such lunacy if you like.
Just an FYI. I did contact the Canadian SC and asked for information pertaining to contacting Ms. Julie Therrien.
This was the contact that Mr. Robin Parsons claimed took his “revolutionary” idea that was used in the John Robin Sharpe case #27376 he never received credit for and was therefore one of the conspirators against him.
I am shocked to report that they have yet to reply.
Even a web search reveals no such a person involved with the CSC as he claimed.
The conspiracy must be vast!
Either that or Mr. Robin Parsons has been shown to have lied yet again.
At best, she was probably a law clerk that no longer works there and not a lawyer as Mr. Robin Parson claimed.
Hi Robin!
First of all I am not Robin.
I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type.
I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type.
Robin has been proven to be a liar as illustrated by the convoluted tall tale of a conspiracy against him from two governments, two politicians and two women who, as he claims, he spurned.
And you are happy to stone him for this (metaphorically speaking)?
Thank you for such freedom. The things I'd like to work out about me are not generally seen as lunatic. But I try to love the lunatics nevertheless. It's tough, I understand.
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love. Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits?
I appreciate that some will say that not all things can be corrected by love. Let's have some examples and see if we can work them out rationally.
As an aside, I watched some re-runs of Star Gate SG1 the other day, and the episode in mind was about a scientist that began suffering schizzophrenia. In a nutshell, Jonas Quinn allowed this scientist to believe he had helped quell a conspiracy against his people. "we couldn't have done it without you" Jonas said, and smiled at the sick scientist. No harm done.
QUOTE (Gehn+Mar 12 2008, 10:40 AM)
Robin ?
Great Marley’s ghost…
? Great Marley’s ghost…
QUOTE (GeneSplicer+Mar 12 2008, 02:43 PM)
First of all I am not Robin.
QUOTE
One does not embrace the intentionally foolish, the charlatan or the liar.
I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| One does not embrace the intentionally foolish, the charlatan or the liar. |
I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type.
Robin has been proven to be a liar as illustrated by the convoluted tall tale of a conspiracy against him from two governments, two politicians and two women who, as he claims, he spurned.
And you are happy to stone him for this (metaphorically speaking)?
QUOTE
You are free to embrace such lunacy if you like.
Thank you for such freedom. The things I'd like to work out about me are not generally seen as lunatic. But I try to love the lunatics nevertheless. It's tough, I understand.
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love. Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits?
I appreciate that some will say that not all things can be corrected by love. Let's have some examples and see if we can work them out rationally.
As an aside, I watched some re-runs of Star Gate SG1 the other day, and the episode in mind was about a scientist that began suffering schizzophrenia. In a nutshell, Jonas Quinn allowed this scientist to believe he had helped quell a conspiracy against his people. "we couldn't have done it without you" Jonas said, and smiled at the sick scientist. No harm done.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 10:12 AM)
And you are happy to stone him for this (metaphorically speaking)?
Quite.
Ahhh, so we should embrace the liars and charlatans, show them love, I see.
Being loved and supported for lying will cause one to stop lying. Negative consequences of immoral behavior don't do so. So when a pedophile considering raping and murdering a child, supporting him in his fantasies and showing him love will stop him. The thought of spending the rest of his life in jail will only egg him on to do it, more!
Marley, want to know one of the greatest bits of advice that can be given? I'm not kidding either, the world would be so much better if everyone took this advice, instead of just the few of us who seem to be capable of such insight...
"Think twice, speak once."
Quite.
QUOTE
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love. Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits?
Ahhh, so we should embrace the liars and charlatans, show them love, I see.
Being loved and supported for lying will cause one to stop lying. Negative consequences of immoral behavior don't do so. So when a pedophile considering raping and murdering a child, supporting him in his fantasies and showing him love will stop him. The thought of spending the rest of his life in jail will only egg him on to do it, more!
Marley, want to know one of the greatest bits of advice that can be given? I'm not kidding either, the world would be so much better if everyone took this advice, instead of just the few of us who seem to be capable of such insight...
"Think twice, speak once."
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 12 2008, 03:30 PM)
Quite.
Ahhh, so we should embrace the liars and charlatans, show them love, I see.
Being loved and supported for lying will cause one to stop lying. Negative consequences of immoral behavior don't do so. So when a pedophile considering raping and murdering a child, supporting him in his fantasies and showing him love will stop him. The thought of spending the rest of his life in jail will only egg him on to do it, more!
Marley, want to know one of the greatest bits of advice that can be given? I'm not kidding either, the world would be so much better if everyone took this advice, instead of just the few of us who seem to be capable of such insight...
"Think twice, speak once."
Thank you for the advice. But, on the contrary, one can ponder on the idea of hating sin by not hating the sinner. I have not said one should embrace liars and charlatans.
Again, there was a good program on tv the other day that dealt , in its own way, with the idea of pedophilia. Love again showed that it can help that person over come this aweful problem. Shouldn't that be what matters, overcoming what we know isn't right? And our role, is it to judge and condemn, or is it to help eradicate these problems people have within their spirits?
Please forgive, but this is not at all what I have said regarding the idea of eradicating these things from our society. We treat these things with scorn, and feel very justified for doing so. We look back, however, and see the problems getting worse and not better. People walking into schools and shooting students and teachers, all on the increase; it's a lack of love in this world. And when we show love , we do so only for our nation, or our friends. The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs. Unforgiveness and judging are the root cause of our problems.
One may also quote the often said thing "if we show the terrorists love, they will just take over and murder us". What is your opinion on that?
Ahhh, so we should embrace the liars and charlatans, show them love, I see.
Being loved and supported for lying will cause one to stop lying. Negative consequences of immoral behavior don't do so. So when a pedophile considering raping and murdering a child, supporting him in his fantasies and showing him love will stop him. The thought of spending the rest of his life in jail will only egg him on to do it, more!
Marley, want to know one of the greatest bits of advice that can be given? I'm not kidding either, the world would be so much better if everyone took this advice, instead of just the few of us who seem to be capable of such insight...
"Think twice, speak once."
Thank you for the advice. But, on the contrary, one can ponder on the idea of hating sin by not hating the sinner. I have not said one should embrace liars and charlatans.
Again, there was a good program on tv the other day that dealt , in its own way, with the idea of pedophilia. Love again showed that it can help that person over come this aweful problem. Shouldn't that be what matters, overcoming what we know isn't right? And our role, is it to judge and condemn, or is it to help eradicate these problems people have within their spirits?
QUOTE
So when a pedophile considering raping and murdering a child, supporting him in his fantasies and showing him love will stop him. The thought of spending the rest of his life in jail will only egg him on to do it, more!
Please forgive, but this is not at all what I have said regarding the idea of eradicating these things from our society. We treat these things with scorn, and feel very justified for doing so. We look back, however, and see the problems getting worse and not better. People walking into schools and shooting students and teachers, all on the increase; it's a lack of love in this world. And when we show love , we do so only for our nation, or our friends. The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs. Unforgiveness and judging are the root cause of our problems.
One may also quote the often said thing "if we show the terrorists love, they will just take over and murder us". What is your opinion on that?
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 08:12 AM)
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love. Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits?
Excuse me for butting in......
(Oh, Hi Robin!)
If you (marley) truly are not Robin Parsons, then you need to understand this. This man came to this forum bragging of un-human skills, wanting us to believe him with absolutely no proof. He was extremely irrational, and demanded respect and adoration from us while he would piss on us from above us on his self elevated platform (since you like metaphors). I wouldn't necessarily peg him as being schizophrenic, but instead would classify him more as extremely narcissistic. True, he believed he was god-like, which could be classified under schizophrenia, but I don't know him well enough to know if he fits other classifications of the disorder.
I don't know why he was homeless, but I would imagine if he didn't like being homeless he would do something about it. I think he "created" an image for himself thinking the government and science would be wowed by him and he would be elevated on a platform by others and would never have to take care of himself or work. Everyone would do it for him since he was a god. But since this has not happened, he pretends that he is the victim, looking for others that will sympathize with him and elevate him to the pedestal which he feels he should be on.
Love doesn't make people like this better people, it makes them spiral out of control into monsters. When he didn't get the respect and admiration that he was demanding, he started to spiral further. He has made claims in the past that he can make people say, do, and think things by getting into their mind. He has also said that knowing what people look like makes this easier. Then he proceeded to post images of some of us that had posted our images saying he could find us. Now, when someone is homeless and has no money, he can't hire a private detective. So what are we left to assume about how he will find us? He claims to have been inside some of our minds, including mine. And he seems to think he is capable of making us think and see things, but that we all lied about the experience.
So the point to my rant is, if you think that love will make this guy a better person, go ahead. Love him and feel sympathy for him and give him what he wants emotionally. He wants someone like you. But be careful, you are feeding a monster. This (Robin) scientist isn't satisfied thinking
Excuse me for butting in......
(Oh, Hi Robin!)
If you (marley) truly are not Robin Parsons, then you need to understand this. This man came to this forum bragging of un-human skills, wanting us to believe him with absolutely no proof. He was extremely irrational, and demanded respect and adoration from us while he would piss on us from above us on his self elevated platform (since you like metaphors). I wouldn't necessarily peg him as being schizophrenic, but instead would classify him more as extremely narcissistic. True, he believed he was god-like, which could be classified under schizophrenia, but I don't know him well enough to know if he fits other classifications of the disorder.
I don't know why he was homeless, but I would imagine if he didn't like being homeless he would do something about it. I think he "created" an image for himself thinking the government and science would be wowed by him and he would be elevated on a platform by others and would never have to take care of himself or work. Everyone would do it for him since he was a god. But since this has not happened, he pretends that he is the victim, looking for others that will sympathize with him and elevate him to the pedestal which he feels he should be on.
Love doesn't make people like this better people, it makes them spiral out of control into monsters. When he didn't get the respect and admiration that he was demanding, he started to spiral further. He has made claims in the past that he can make people say, do, and think things by getting into their mind. He has also said that knowing what people look like makes this easier. Then he proceeded to post images of some of us that had posted our images saying he could find us. Now, when someone is homeless and has no money, he can't hire a private detective. So what are we left to assume about how he will find us? He claims to have been inside some of our minds, including mine. And he seems to think he is capable of making us think and see things, but that we all lied about the experience.
So the point to my rant is, if you think that love will make this guy a better person, go ahead. Love him and feel sympathy for him and give him what he wants emotionally. He wants someone like you. But be careful, you are feeding a monster. This (Robin) scientist isn't satisfied thinking
QUOTE
"we couldn't have done it without you"
, he wants to be praised and elevated on his platform and worshipped. Go ahead, do it. Just leave us out of it please.
Hi Robin!
QUOTE (marlley+)
First of all I am not Robin.
It was a joke.
Irrelevant claptrap. I really don’t care to hear about or discuss your “one love” nonsense. Such an outlook is simply foreign to our world and our reality.
Irrelevant claptrap. I really don’t care to hear about or discuss your “one love” nonsense. Such an outlook is simply foreign to our world and our reality.
And you are happy to stone him for this (metaphorically speaking)?
Stone him?! Gee, what happened to that “one love” outlook? Robin simply make untenable claims and was duly exposed as a liar. This doesn’t even go into his ad nausea claims of liable and defamation and his constant insults of a personal nature.
Again, your choice.
Again, your choice.
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love.
Again, nonsensical claim. Love does not and cannot address a person’s desire to post self aggrandizing fabrications not to mention a person who is intentionally and willfully ignorant.
To quote a great philosopher “You cannot fix stupid.”
If you wish to talk about your nonsensical “one love” and “dark spots” claim you have posted now in multiple threads, then kindly start a thread about that topic.
If you wish to talk about your nonsensical “one love” and “dark spots” claim you have posted now in multiple threads, then kindly start a thread about that topic.
As an aside, I watched some re-runs of Star Gate SG1 the other day, and the episode in mind was about a scientist that began suffering schizzophrenia. In a nutshell, Jonas Quinn allowed this scientist to believe he had helped quell a conspiracy against his people. "we couldn't have done it without you" Jonas said, and smiled at the sick scientist. No harm done.
Your “aside” is a bit lacking in details. Jonas Quinn comforted the sickened scientist who continue to think the conspiracy to overthrow what he saw as the corrupt government of Kolona was still yet to happen but would. You also fail to mention that this sickened scientist was actually critically ill and dying and was the mentor and close friend of Jonas.
Not the same as embracing and accepting lunacy.
It was a joke.
QUOTE
I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type.
Irrelevant claptrap. I really don’t care to hear about or discuss your “one love” nonsense. Such an outlook is simply foreign to our world and our reality.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| I am glad to hear one doesn't. Always good to cast those things out of oneself, don't you think? Then maybe national pride, and national love can embrace more of the universal type. |
Irrelevant claptrap. I really don’t care to hear about or discuss your “one love” nonsense. Such an outlook is simply foreign to our world and our reality.
And you are happy to stone him for this (metaphorically speaking)?
Stone him?! Gee, what happened to that “one love” outlook? Robin simply make untenable claims and was duly exposed as a liar. This doesn’t even go into his ad nausea claims of liable and defamation and his constant insults of a personal nature.
QUOTE
Thank you for such freedom. The things I'd like to work out about me are not generally seen as lunatic. But I try to love the lunatics nevertheless. It's tough, I understand.
Again, your choice.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Thank you for such freedom. The things I'd like to work out about me are not generally seen as lunatic. But I try to love the lunatics nevertheless. It's tough, I understand. |
Again, your choice.
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love.
Again, nonsensical claim. Love does not and cannot address a person’s desire to post self aggrandizing fabrications not to mention a person who is intentionally and willfully ignorant.
To quote a great philosopher “You cannot fix stupid.”
QUOTE
Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits?
If you wish to talk about your nonsensical “one love” and “dark spots” claim you have posted now in multiple threads, then kindly start a thread about that topic.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Therefore, is it logical to suggest that part of our make up is to actually want things to be wrong, so that we can judge? Is judging each other one of the dark spots in our spirits? |
If you wish to talk about your nonsensical “one love” and “dark spots” claim you have posted now in multiple threads, then kindly start a thread about that topic.
As an aside, I watched some re-runs of Star Gate SG1 the other day, and the episode in mind was about a scientist that began suffering schizzophrenia. In a nutshell, Jonas Quinn allowed this scientist to believe he had helped quell a conspiracy against his people. "we couldn't have done it without you" Jonas said, and smiled at the sick scientist. No harm done.
Your “aside” is a bit lacking in details. Jonas Quinn comforted the sickened scientist who continue to think the conspiracy to overthrow what he saw as the corrupt government of Kolona was still yet to happen but would. You also fail to mention that this sickened scientist was actually critically ill and dying and was the mentor and close friend of Jonas.
Not the same as embracing and accepting lunacy.
QUOTE ("THEY"+Mar 12 2008, 03:49 PM)
Excuse me for butting in......
(Oh, Hi Robin!)
If you (marley) truly are not Robin Parsons, then you need to understand this. This man came to this forum bragging of un-human skills, wanting us to believe him with absolutely no proof. He was extremely irrational, and demanded respect and adoration from us while he would piss on us from above us on his self elevated platform (since you like metaphors). I wouldn't necessarily peg him as being schizophrenic, but instead would classify him more as extremely narcissistic. True, he believed he was god-like, which could be classified under schizophrenia, but I don't know him well enough to know if he fits other classifications of the disorder.
I don't know why he was homeless, but I would imagine if he didn't like being homeless he would do something about it. I think he "created" an image for himself thinking the government and science would be wowed by him and he would be elevated on a platform by others and would never have to take care of himself or work. Everyone would do it for him since he was a god. But since this has not happened, he pretends that he is the victim, looking for others that will sympathize with him and elevate him to the pedestal which he feels he should be on.
Love doesn't make people like this better people, it makes them spiral out of control into monsters. When he didn't get the respect and admiration that he was demanding, he started to spiral further. He has made claims in the past that he can make people say, do, and think things by getting into their mind. He has also said that knowing what people look like makes this easier. Then he proceeded to post images of some of us that had posted our images saying he could find us. Now, when someone is homeless and has no money, he can't hire a private detective. So what are we left to assume about how he will find us? He claims to have been inside some of our minds, including mine. And he seems to think he is capable of making us think and see things, but that we all lied about the experience.
So the point to my rant is, if you think that love will make this guy a better person, go ahead. Love him and feel sympathy for him and give him what he wants emotionally. He wants someone like you. But be careful, you are feeding a monster. This (Robin) scientist isn't satisfied thinking , he wants to be praised and elevated on his platform and worshipped. Go ahead, do it. Just leave us out of it please.
THEY, please consider that, however much you'd like to be "left out of it", this cannot be so. You are in it, and always will be.
Why is the impression here that I am Robin btw?
Genesplicer:
Thank you for your response. I will continue in the assurrance that universal love
is the key to the future of this world, and will leave behind the fragmented judgements that we choose to practice.
One indeed can fix stupid. But where one applies the spanner is what life is all about.
(Oh, Hi Robin!)
If you (marley) truly are not Robin Parsons, then you need to understand this. This man came to this forum bragging of un-human skills, wanting us to believe him with absolutely no proof. He was extremely irrational, and demanded respect and adoration from us while he would piss on us from above us on his self elevated platform (since you like metaphors). I wouldn't necessarily peg him as being schizophrenic, but instead would classify him more as extremely narcissistic. True, he believed he was god-like, which could be classified under schizophrenia, but I don't know him well enough to know if he fits other classifications of the disorder.
I don't know why he was homeless, but I would imagine if he didn't like being homeless he would do something about it. I think he "created" an image for himself thinking the government and science would be wowed by him and he would be elevated on a platform by others and would never have to take care of himself or work. Everyone would do it for him since he was a god. But since this has not happened, he pretends that he is the victim, looking for others that will sympathize with him and elevate him to the pedestal which he feels he should be on.
Love doesn't make people like this better people, it makes them spiral out of control into monsters. When he didn't get the respect and admiration that he was demanding, he started to spiral further. He has made claims in the past that he can make people say, do, and think things by getting into their mind. He has also said that knowing what people look like makes this easier. Then he proceeded to post images of some of us that had posted our images saying he could find us. Now, when someone is homeless and has no money, he can't hire a private detective. So what are we left to assume about how he will find us? He claims to have been inside some of our minds, including mine. And he seems to think he is capable of making us think and see things, but that we all lied about the experience.
So the point to my rant is, if you think that love will make this guy a better person, go ahead. Love him and feel sympathy for him and give him what he wants emotionally. He wants someone like you. But be careful, you are feeding a monster. This (Robin) scientist isn't satisfied thinking , he wants to be praised and elevated on his platform and worshipped. Go ahead, do it. Just leave us out of it please.
THEY, please consider that, however much you'd like to be "left out of it", this cannot be so. You are in it, and always will be.
Why is the impression here that I am Robin btw?
Genesplicer:
Thank you for your response. I will continue in the assurrance that universal love
is the key to the future of this world, and will leave behind the fragmented judgements that we choose to practice.
One indeed can fix stupid. But where one applies the spanner is what life is all about.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 04:02 PM)
THEY, please consider that, however much you'd like to be "left out of it", this cannot be so. You are in it, and always will be.
"THEY" was merely stating that she does not want to join in your fun by loving Mr. Robin Parsons.
Why is the impression here that I am Robin btw?
As Genesplicer just stated, it was a joke. Unless, of course, you are Robin.
That will only work if EVERYONE chooses to love everyone else. But people don't do that, so the people who do choose to love everyone else will be taken advantage of because they do not have the foresight to realize that they will be taken advantage of.
"THEY" was merely stating that she does not want to join in your fun by loving Mr. Robin Parsons.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 04:02 PM)
Why is the impression here that I am Robin btw?
As Genesplicer just stated, it was a joke. Unless, of course, you are Robin.
QUOTE
I will continue in the assurrance that universal love
is the key to the future of this world, and will leave behind the fragmented judgements that we choose to practice.
is the key to the future of this world, and will leave behind the fragmented judgements that we choose to practice.
That will only work if EVERYONE chooses to love everyone else. But people don't do that, so the people who do choose to love everyone else will be taken advantage of because they do not have the foresight to realize that they will be taken advantage of.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 10:48 AM)
Thank you for the advice. But, on the contrary, one can ponder on the idea of hating sin by not hating the sinner. I have not said one should embrace liars and charlatans.
That doesn't make sense. "But, on the contrary," should preface something that disagrees with the advice, not something which doesn't have anything to do with the advice.
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
Please forgive, but this is not at all what I have said regarding the idea of eradicating these things from our society.
You said
"if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love."
Which STRONGLY implies a lack of punishment, or negative consequences.
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
We look back, however, and see the problems getting worse and not better.
Do you truly believe that there is more crime now than in the previous centuries?? That is just plain WRONG.
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
it's a lack of love in this world.
You are not qualified to pass such judgment.
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs.
Once again, you are not qualified to pass such judgments, and this one has absolutely no basis in evidence.
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
One may also quote the often said thing "if we show the terrorists love, they will just take over and murder us". What is your opinion on that?
Unfortunately, it is true. Not all people are reasonable, intelligent people. Some are simply determined to hurt others, at whatever cost to themselves or their families. Some have been "brainwashed" by religion into believing things they would not have otherwise believed. Despite the fact that over 50% of the GNP of oil-producing middle eastern countries stems from oil sales to American-owned companies, they still blame America for their lack of financial assets, instead of blaming the elite nobility of their own countries for seizing these assets before they make their way to the general population. Is that reasonable?
If all men were truly reasonable and capable of love and affection to the same (full) extent, there would be no problems to fix, so proposing a solution to such problems that requires the assumption that all men are reasonable and capable of love and affection the the same (full) extent is not logical, reasonable, or practical.
That doesn't make sense. "But, on the contrary," should preface something that disagrees with the advice, not something which doesn't have anything to do with the advice.
QUOTE
Again, there was a good program on tv the other day that dealt , in its own way, with the idea of pedophilia. Love again showed that it can help that person over come this aweful problem. Shouldn't that be what matters, overcoming what we know isn't right? And our role, is it to judge and condemn, or is it to help eradicate these problems people have within their spirits?
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Again, there was a good program on tv the other day that dealt , in its own way, with the idea of pedophilia. Love again showed that it can help that person over come this aweful problem. Shouldn't that be what matters, overcoming what we know isn't right? And our role, is it to judge and condemn, or is it to help eradicate these problems people have within their spirits? |
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
Please forgive, but this is not at all what I have said regarding the idea of eradicating these things from our society.
You said
"if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love."
Which STRONGLY implies a lack of punishment, or negative consequences.
QUOTE
We treat these things with scorn, and feel very justified for doing so.
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| We treat these things with scorn, and feel very justified for doing so. |
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
We look back, however, and see the problems getting worse and not better.
Do you truly believe that there is more crime now than in the previous centuries?? That is just plain WRONG.
QUOTE
People walking into schools and shooting students and teachers, all on the increase;
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| People walking into schools and shooting students and teachers, all on the increase; |
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
it's a lack of love in this world.
You are not qualified to pass such judgment.
QUOTE
And when we show love , we do so only for our nation, or our friends.
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| And when we show love , we do so only for our nation, or our friends. |
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs.
Once again, you are not qualified to pass such judgments, and this one has absolutely no basis in evidence.
QUOTE
Unforgiveness and judging are the root cause of our problems.
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Unforgiveness and judging are the root cause of our problems. |
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
One may also quote the often said thing "if we show the terrorists love, they will just take over and murder us". What is your opinion on that?
Unfortunately, it is true. Not all people are reasonable, intelligent people. Some are simply determined to hurt others, at whatever cost to themselves or their families. Some have been "brainwashed" by religion into believing things they would not have otherwise believed. Despite the fact that over 50% of the GNP of oil-producing middle eastern countries stems from oil sales to American-owned companies, they still blame America for their lack of financial assets, instead of blaming the elite nobility of their own countries for seizing these assets before they make their way to the general population. Is that reasonable?
If all men were truly reasonable and capable of love and affection to the same (full) extent, there would be no problems to fix, so proposing a solution to such problems that requires the assumption that all men are reasonable and capable of love and affection the the same (full) extent is not logical, reasonable, or practical.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 09:02 AM)
Why is the impression here that I am Robin btw?
a/ because you are supporting him so strongly, and
b/ comments like this
I would get tired of Robin's tirade, and quit responding to his posts. In the meantime, I would be receiving PMs stating he was saying things about me. He loved to goad me to try to make me come back and debate him. So if I am in it, and always will be, it appears the choice is not mine, but yours.
Do I have your permission to wash my hands clean of someone I believe to be mentally unstable? If you aren't him, then let us be.
a/ because you are supporting him so strongly, and
b/ comments like this
QUOTE
THEY, please consider that, however much you'd like to be "left out of it", this cannot be so. You are in it, and always will be.
I would get tired of Robin's tirade, and quit responding to his posts. In the meantime, I would be receiving PMs stating he was saying things about me. He loved to goad me to try to make me come back and debate him. So if I am in it, and always will be, it appears the choice is not mine, but yours.
Do I have your permission to wash my hands clean of someone I believe to be mentally unstable? If you aren't him, then let us be.
QUOTE (Gehn+Mar 12 2008, 04:10 PM)
"THEY" was merely stating that she does not want to join in your fun by loving Mr. Robin Parsons.
As Genesplicer just stated, it was a joke. Unless, of course, you are Robin.
That will only work if EVERYONE chooses to love everyone else. But people don't do that, so the people who do choose to love everyone else will be taken advantage of because they do not have the foresight to realize that they will be taken advantage of.
Hi Gehn
You are choosing to think that someone practicing a kind of universal love is something one can take advantage of? I don't think so. Unconditional love is the only true reality. If something is not of that fine stuff, it will merely be an illusion. And that illusion may be alluring, when we have our own attachments to blind us,
but take away fear and doubt, and this illusion has no power whatsoever. The only power is that of unconditional love. How can anyone be taken advantage of?
You may have the idea of unconditional love mixed up with the conditional love, like "i'll love you if you love me, I'll support your ego and attachments if you support mine". This isn't love. Part of why the world is in a strnage sorry state is that the love we generally practice is ego blindness. And they do say that the blind leading the blind will surely fall in a ditch. Now why would I want that to happen to you? I don't. My only wish is to plant the idea of another type of love. What you do with it is obviously up to you. I don't have to give an account for you actions in this life. I have to give an account for mine.
As Genesplicer just stated, it was a joke. Unless, of course, you are Robin.
That will only work if EVERYONE chooses to love everyone else. But people don't do that, so the people who do choose to love everyone else will be taken advantage of because they do not have the foresight to realize that they will be taken advantage of.
Hi Gehn
You are choosing to think that someone practicing a kind of universal love is something one can take advantage of? I don't think so. Unconditional love is the only true reality. If something is not of that fine stuff, it will merely be an illusion. And that illusion may be alluring, when we have our own attachments to blind us,
but take away fear and doubt, and this illusion has no power whatsoever. The only power is that of unconditional love. How can anyone be taken advantage of?
You may have the idea of unconditional love mixed up with the conditional love, like "i'll love you if you love me, I'll support your ego and attachments if you support mine". This isn't love. Part of why the world is in a strnage sorry state is that the love we generally practice is ego blindness. And they do say that the blind leading the blind will surely fall in a ditch. Now why would I want that to happen to you? I don't. My only wish is to plant the idea of another type of love. What you do with it is obviously up to you. I don't have to give an account for you actions in this life. I have to give an account for mine.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 09:12 AM)
Think about this - if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love.
You think you can change people?
Let me know how that works out for you.
You think you can change people?
Let me know how that works out for you.
CONDITIONAL LOVE???? 
you mean the conditional love that Robin demands?
I am thinking BigDumbWeirdo is right about you. And I trust his judgement of potsmokers better than mine. Besides, you didn't debate that part!
you mean the conditional love that Robin demands?I am thinking BigDumbWeirdo is right about you. And I trust his judgement of potsmokers better than mine. Besides, you didn't debate that part!
Hi Robin!
I didn’t think Rastafarians were so baked as to think it is wise to love someone who wants to harm or who has harmed you.
That sounds rather unwise.
I didn’t think Rastafarians were so baked as to think it is wise to love someone who wants to harm or who has harmed you.
That sounds rather unwise.
QUOTE ("THEY"+Mar 12 2008, 04:22 PM)
a/ because you are supporting him so strongly, and
b/ comments like this
I would get tired of Robin's tirade, and quit responding to his posts. In the meantime, I would be receiving PMs stating he was saying things about me. He loved to goad me to try to make me come back and debate him. So if I am in it, and always will be, it appears the choice is not mine, but yours.
Do I have your permission to wash my hands clean of someone I believe to be mentally unstable? If you aren't him, then let us be.
THEY, I do not wish to support anybody. I only wish to support unconditional Love. I have had instances in my life where I could easily have replied with your post to ones like mine.
And my reference to you being in it is not meant in a personal sense. The quality of your spirit cannot hide itself amongst those that support its state. The measure is whether or not spirits have learnt or are learning the lesson of unconditional love. And what good is a lesson that does not test? God could have created articifical robots. Instead "seeds" are planted, and they grow through their own experiences. And we are all brothers and sisters.
b/ comments like this
I would get tired of Robin's tirade, and quit responding to his posts. In the meantime, I would be receiving PMs stating he was saying things about me. He loved to goad me to try to make me come back and debate him. So if I am in it, and always will be, it appears the choice is not mine, but yours.
Do I have your permission to wash my hands clean of someone I believe to be mentally unstable? If you aren't him, then let us be.
THEY, I do not wish to support anybody. I only wish to support unconditional Love. I have had instances in my life where I could easily have replied with your post to ones like mine.
And my reference to you being in it is not meant in a personal sense. The quality of your spirit cannot hide itself amongst those that support its state. The measure is whether or not spirits have learnt or are learning the lesson of unconditional love. And what good is a lesson that does not test? God could have created articifical robots. Instead "seeds" are planted, and they grow through their own experiences. And we are all brothers and sisters.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 04:30 PM)
Hi Gehn
You are choosing to think that someone practicing a kind of universal love is something one can take advantage of? I don't think so.
Unconditional love is the only true reality. If something is not of that fine stuff, it will merely be an illusion. And that illusion may be alluring, when we have our own attachments to blind us,
but take away fear and doubt, and this illusion has no power whatsoever. The only power is that of unconditional love. How can anyone be taken advantage of?
I do mean unconditional love. Let's say a random man comes up to you in the street, and tells you that he is in desperate need of money. If you give him $1,000 today, he will give you $2000 in 9 months. Because of your unconditional love, you agree. A few years go by, and you never see him again.
Unconditional love would result in many incidents like this.
You may have the idea of unconditional love mixed up with the conditional love, like "i'll love you if you love me, I'll support your ego and attachments if you support mine". This isn't love. Part of why the world is in a strnage sorry state is that the love we generally practice is ego blindness. And they do say that the blind leading the blind will surely fall in a ditch. Now why would I want that to happen to you? I don't.
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
I don't have to give an account for you actions in this life. I have to give an account for mine.
So you're just doing this so you can get through the pearly gates. Isn't that a bit shallow?
- Gehn
That may be because you are still equating unconditional love with blindness and perhaps gullibility.
That may be because you are still equating unconditional love with blindness and perhaps gullibility.
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
Unconditional love is a state of being, not judged by actions of giving or taking.
It cannot be forced on anyone, as if that forcing is just another form of judgment. Just presenting the idea can be sufficient. It's for you to choose and decide.
So you're just doing this so you can get through the pearly gates. Isn't that a bit shallow?
Depends what you mean by "getting through". Achieving the state of Unconditional Love is its own reward. Everything else is an attempt to get through the pearly gates by jumping over the fence.
You are choosing to think that someone practicing a kind of universal love is something one can take advantage of? I don't think so.
Unconditional love is the only true reality. If something is not of that fine stuff, it will merely be an illusion. And that illusion may be alluring, when we have our own attachments to blind us,
but take away fear and doubt, and this illusion has no power whatsoever. The only power is that of unconditional love. How can anyone be taken advantage of?
I do mean unconditional love. Let's say a random man comes up to you in the street, and tells you that he is in desperate need of money. If you give him $1,000 today, he will give you $2000 in 9 months. Because of your unconditional love, you agree. A few years go by, and you never see him again.
Unconditional love would result in many incidents like this.
QUOTE
You may have the idea of unconditional love mixed up with the conditional love, like "i'll love you if you love me, I'll support your ego and attachments if you support mine". This isn't love. Part of why the world is in a strnage sorry state is that the love we generally practice is ego blindness. And they do say that the blind leading the blind will surely fall in a ditch. Now why would I want that to happen to you? I don't.
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
You may have the idea of unconditional love mixed up with the conditional love, like "i'll love you if you love me, I'll support your ego and attachments if you support mine". This isn't love. Part of why the world is in a strnage sorry state is that the love we generally practice is ego blindness. And they do say that the blind leading the blind will surely fall in a ditch. Now why would I want that to happen to you? I don't. |
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
I don't have to give an account for you actions in this life. I have to give an account for mine.
So you're just doing this so you can get through the pearly gates. Isn't that a bit shallow?
- Gehn
QUOTE ("THEY"+Mar 12 2008, 12:35 PM)
CONDITIONAL LOVE???? you mean the conditional love that Robin demands?
I am thinking BigDumbWeirdo is right about you. And I trust his judgement of potsmokers better than mine. Besides, you didn't debate that part!
As it has been stated, Robin demanded to be believed regardless of problems in his claim that flew in the face of common sense not to mention his lack of any substance to back up his claims.
It simply came down to two categories for him. Either you were open minded and believed his hollow claims or he called you a professional skeptic, closed minded or out to destroy his “character”, as if he actually possessed any.
Love, unconditional or otherwise, can do nothing to address such people. It will only encourage them to continue to lie and make personal claims of an insulting manner about those who do not buy their tall tales.
you mean the conditional love that Robin demands?I am thinking BigDumbWeirdo is right about you. And I trust his judgement of potsmokers better than mine. Besides, you didn't debate that part!
As it has been stated, Robin demanded to be believed regardless of problems in his claim that flew in the face of common sense not to mention his lack of any substance to back up his claims.
It simply came down to two categories for him. Either you were open minded and believed his hollow claims or he called you a professional skeptic, closed minded or out to destroy his “character”, as if he actually possessed any.
Love, unconditional or otherwise, can do nothing to address such people. It will only encourage them to continue to lie and make personal claims of an insulting manner about those who do not buy their tall tales.
Well well. I don't think I can change anyone actually. I can only observe the reactions when unconditional love is offered as an idea.
QUOTE (Gehn+Mar 12 2008, 04:48 PM)
QUOTE
I do mean unconditional love. Let's say a random man comes up to you in the street, and tells you that he is in desperate need of money. If you give him $1,000 today, he will give you $2000 in 9 months. Because of your unconditional love, you agree. A few years go by, and you never see him again.
Unconditional love would result in many incidents like this.
Unconditional love would result in many incidents like this.
That may be because you are still equating unconditional love with blindness and perhaps gullibility.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| I do mean unconditional love. Let's say a random man comes up to you in the street, and tells you that he is in desperate need of money. If you give him $1,000 today, he will give you $2000 in 9 months. Because of your unconditional love, you agree. A few years go by, and you never see him again. Unconditional love would result in many incidents like this. |
That may be because you are still equating unconditional love with blindness and perhaps gullibility.
Love isn't just something you should freely give to everyone, as you seem to think. Disliking someone is fine.
Unconditional love is a state of being, not judged by actions of giving or taking.
It cannot be forced on anyone, as if that forcing is just another form of judgment. Just presenting the idea can be sufficient. It's for you to choose and decide.
QUOTE
So you're just doing this so you can get through the pearly gates. Isn't that a bit shallow?
Depends what you mean by "getting through". Achieving the state of Unconditional Love is its own reward. Everything else is an attempt to get through the pearly gates by jumping over the fence.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 09:50 AM)
Well well. I don't think I can change anyone actually. I can only observe the reactions when unconditional love is offered as an idea.
Nice to hear. I am very capable of unconditional love, but I find it hard to unconditionally love when someone demands unconditional and conditional love with nothing in return. But don't worry, you aren't the one making demands. That comment was definitely not directed at you, so please don't take it that way.
Nice to hear. I am very capable of unconditional love, but I find it hard to unconditionally love when someone demands unconditional and conditional love with nothing in return. But don't worry, you aren't the one making demands. That comment was definitely not directed at you, so please don't take it that way.
Marley, do you have anything to say in response to my last post, or not?
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 12 2008, 04:22 PM)
That doesn't make sense. "But, on the contrary," should preface something that disagrees with the advice, not something which doesn't have anything to do with the advice.
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
You said
"if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love."
Which STRONGLY implies a lack of punishment, or negative consequences.
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
Do you truly believe that there is more crime now than in the previous centuries?? That is just plain WRONG.
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
You are not qualified to pass such judgment.
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
Once again, you are not qualified to pass such judgments, and this one has absolutely no basis in evidence.
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
Unfortunately, it is true. Not all people are reasonable, intelligent people. Some are simply determined to hurt others, at whatever cost to themselves or their families. Some have been "brainwashed" by religion into believing things they would not have otherwise believed. Despite the fact that over 50% of the GNP of oil-producing middle eastern countries stems from oil sales to American-owned companies, they still blame America for their lack of financial assets, instead of blaming the elite nobility of their own countries for seizing these assets before they make their way to the general population. Is that reasonable?
If all men were truly reasonable and capable of love and affection to the same (full) extent, there would be no problems to fix, so proposing a solution to such problems that requires the assumption that all men are reasonable and capable of love and affection the the same (full) extent is not logical, reasonable, or practical.
Hi Bigdumbweirdo
You have made a number of assumptions in your post here. I am certainly not a Rasta, regardless of being called Marley and advocating One Love. Having had many West Indian friends I do know all about the great Bob, and a little about his religion.
I understand some of the concerns that you have raised. I think I dismiss the thought that if we all went around practicing uncondtional love we would all be letting murderers off the hook, and rapists and pedophiles etc etc. I seem to see it differently. The fact that we don't practice unconditional love as a species has led to murderers and rapists etc. I've not heard of a case where someone is murdered due to the murderer having unconditional love for their victim. There is usuallly a condition involved. The fruits of conditionality are well documented, and when someone practices it and gets caught in some vile crime, then they should expect to pay their debt. The idea of unconditional love healing all wrongs is tied in with self forgiveness especially. It isn't an outside thing being applied to an individual. As Jesus said, it is our faith that has healed us.
A "good program on tv" doesn't qualify as a valid scientific study. I can pull shows off of local-access cable stations from throughout the deep south which "prove" that black people are stupid, violent, immoral, and stinky, by applying the same logic you just did. So is that your position? That anything presented as non-fiction on television must be true? "Reefer madness" was broadcast on television, in a non-fiction format. Does that mean you went berserk and murdered and raped someone the last time you got high? (I'm assuming that you do get high due to your name and your references to "One love" which strongly indicate you are a practicing Rastafarian, which -for those who are unaware- is a religion which deifies Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, and incorporates the smoking of marijuana into it's religious rituals.Wikipedia.com - Rastafari)
You said
"if we REALLY want people to stop behaving a certain way, we can heal any wrong with Love."
Which STRONGLY implies a lack of punishment, or negative consequences.
Rightly so. This tendency of humanity to vilify criminals is quite useful to society.
Do you truly believe that there is more crime now than in the previous centuries?? That is just plain WRONG.
Only over the past 2 or 3 decades.
You are not qualified to pass such judgment.
That is a patently untrue generalization. There are countless people out there, myself among them, who consider those of other nationalities to have the same rights as our countrymen. I recently participated in a debate in my local town hall over immigration, arguing that illegal immigrants should be given the opportunity to become citizens, and to learn English, against a man who argued that they deserve only to be shipped back to their own country, or jailed.
Once again, you are not qualified to pass such judgments, and this one has absolutely no basis in evidence.
See what I said about the last quote of yours.
Unfortunately, it is true. Not all people are reasonable, intelligent people. Some are simply determined to hurt others, at whatever cost to themselves or their families. Some have been "brainwashed" by religion into believing things they would not have otherwise believed. Despite the fact that over 50% of the GNP of oil-producing middle eastern countries stems from oil sales to American-owned companies, they still blame America for their lack of financial assets, instead of blaming the elite nobility of their own countries for seizing these assets before they make their way to the general population. Is that reasonable?
If all men were truly reasonable and capable of love and affection to the same (full) extent, there would be no problems to fix, so proposing a solution to such problems that requires the assumption that all men are reasonable and capable of love and affection the the same (full) extent is not logical, reasonable, or practical.
Hi Bigdumbweirdo
You have made a number of assumptions in your post here. I am certainly not a Rasta, regardless of being called Marley and advocating One Love. Having had many West Indian friends I do know all about the great Bob, and a little about his religion.
I understand some of the concerns that you have raised. I think I dismiss the thought that if we all went around practicing uncondtional love we would all be letting murderers off the hook, and rapists and pedophiles etc etc. I seem to see it differently. The fact that we don't practice unconditional love as a species has led to murderers and rapists etc. I've not heard of a case where someone is murdered due to the murderer having unconditional love for their victim. There is usuallly a condition involved. The fruits of conditionality are well documented, and when someone practices it and gets caught in some vile crime, then they should expect to pay their debt. The idea of unconditional love healing all wrongs is tied in with self forgiveness especially. It isn't an outside thing being applied to an individual. As Jesus said, it is our faith that has healed us.
Okay, first of all, hi Robin! Good to see you miss us. We miss you, too.
marley: I haven't read the entirety of your posts in this thread but no, unconditional love won't solve everything.
GeneSplicer: Keep up the good work bud
marley: I haven't read the entirety of your posts in this thread but no, unconditional love won't solve everything.
GeneSplicer: Keep up the good work bud
Sometimes you have to love someone enough to allow them to suffer the consequences of their actions... Otherwise they never have the opportunity to grow.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 12:54 PM)
You have made a number of assumptions in your post here. I am certainly not a Rasta, regardless of being called Marley and advocating One Love. Having had many West Indian friends I do know all about the great Bob, and a little about his religion.
As have you.
(Bob Marley is neither the progenitor nor a major religious leader in the Rastafari movement.)
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
The fact that we don't practice unconditional love as a species has led to murderers and rapists etc.
But you must either acknowledge that such is not the only reason, or else divorce yourself from reality. A complete lack of emotions among humans would also result in a lack of violent crime, as violent crime is simply not logical.
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
The fruits of conditionality are well documented, and when someone practices it and gets caught in some vile crime, then they should expect to pay their debt.
As Robin did. He practiced the moral crimes of lying, condescension, arrogance, and willingly held delusions. As a result, he was ostracized from the community in which he was most capable of spreading whatever message he intended to spread, and was vilified during and after his banishment.
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
It isn't an outside thing being applied to an individual. As Jesus said, it is our faith that has healed us.
That is not a quote from jesus. That IS the sort of thing he MIGHT have said.
This, in and of itself is a lie, are you aware of that? Misquoting someone is the same as claiming they've said that which they haven't, a lie.
Thank you, I was aware of that.
Thank you, I was aware of that.
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
No, this thing called "form" is the very thing that is changing in some people's minds. We now are becoming aware of the conciousness within the form. we are not the form. So to reform something is only to catapult it into some other condional awareness. Look up, if you so wish, the idea of the Seven Rays. Again I am not saying I support what this view is about, I simply have gained some helpful insights from it.
But you must either acknowledge that such is not the only reason, or else divorce yourself from reality. A complete lack of emotions among humans would also result in a lack of violent crime, as violent crime is simply not logical.
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because.
And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect.
And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect.
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution. Myself and many others are putting this to the test. We are many more than perhaps would seem the case. We have seen the need for a higher love, and have chosen to place it at the table where rationality is discoursed. I would like to see if it can be further accepted as a practical solution to various problems we face.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
My apologies. You are correct, it is a quote accredited to have been said by Jesus.
As have you.
(Bob Marley is neither the progenitor nor a major religious leader in the Rastafari movement.)
QUOTE
I think I dismiss the thought that if we all went around practicing uncondtional love we would all be letting murderers off the hook, and rapists and pedophiles etc etc.
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| I think I dismiss the thought that if we all went around practicing uncondtional love we would all be letting murderers off the hook, and rapists and pedophiles etc etc. |
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
The fact that we don't practice unconditional love as a species has led to murderers and rapists etc.
But you must either acknowledge that such is not the only reason, or else divorce yourself from reality. A complete lack of emotions among humans would also result in a lack of violent crime, as violent crime is simply not logical.
QUOTE
I've not heard of a case where someone is murdered due to the murderer having unconditional love for their victim.
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| I've not heard of a case where someone is murdered due to the murderer having unconditional love for their victim. |
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
The fruits of conditionality are well documented, and when someone practices it and gets caught in some vile crime, then they should expect to pay their debt.
As Robin did. He practiced the moral crimes of lying, condescension, arrogance, and willingly held delusions. As a result, he was ostracized from the community in which he was most capable of spreading whatever message he intended to spread, and was vilified during and after his banishment.
QUOTE
The idea of unconditional love healing all wrongs is tied in with self forgiveness especially.
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| The idea of unconditional love healing all wrongs is tied in with self forgiveness especially. |
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
It isn't an outside thing being applied to an individual. As Jesus said, it is our faith that has healed us.
That is not a quote from jesus. That IS the sort of thing he MIGHT have said.
This, in and of itself is a lie, are you aware of that? Misquoting someone is the same as claiming they've said that which they haven't, a lie.
QUOTE (GeneSplicer+)
The conspiracy must be vast!
AHAHAHAHAHA BWHAHAHAHAHA AHAHAHAHA
Brilliant! GeneSplicer, you iz da man
AHAHAHAHAHA BWHAHAHAHAHA AHAHAHAHA
Brilliant! GeneSplicer, you iz da man
QUOTE (gmilam+Mar 12 2008, 06:12 PM)
Sometimes you have to love someone enough to allow them to suffer the consequences of their actions... Otherwise they never have the opportunity to grow.
That I have every faith in as being a certain way toward helping to release someone from their problems. Not to get drawn in by it, or to support it, but to stand back. And it can be turned on its head by saying that we protect our own problems by supporting the same ones in others. If we project that kind of spirit, we see something similar to the world in which we live in, fragmented and becoming damaged.
That I have every faith in as being a certain way toward helping to release someone from their problems. Not to get drawn in by it, or to support it, but to stand back. And it can be turned on its head by saying that we protect our own problems by supporting the same ones in others. If we project that kind of spirit, we see something similar to the world in which we live in, fragmented and becoming damaged.
You can not change someone if they do not wish to change.
Parsons does not wish to change.
Oh, and i've opened my 360 blog to all for comments, seeing as how he's seen fit to close his.
Parsons does not wish to change.
Oh, and i've opened my 360 blog to all for comments, seeing as how he's seen fit to close his.
QUOTE
(Bob Marley is neither the progenitor nor a major religious leader in the Rastafari movement.)
Thank you, I was aware of that.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| (Bob Marley is neither the progenitor nor a major religious leader in the Rastafari movement.) |
Thank you, I was aware of that.
Then the only conclusion about your view of criminality is that reform is the only answer, and unfortunately, most murderers, drug addicts, and rapists cannot be reformed.
No, this thing called "form" is the very thing that is changing in some people's minds. We now are becoming aware of the conciousness within the form. we are not the form. So to reform something is only to catapult it into some other condional awareness. Look up, if you so wish, the idea of the Seven Rays. Again I am not saying I support what this view is about, I simply have gained some helpful insights from it.
QUOTE
But you must either acknowledge that such is not the only reason, or else divorce yourself from reality. A complete lack of emotions among humans would also result in a lack of violent crime, as violent crime is simply not logical.
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
But you must either acknowledge that such is not the only reason, or else divorce yourself from reality. A complete lack of emotions among humans would also result in a lack of violent crime, as violent crime is simply not logical. |
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
I have. Many many times. They are referred to as "Crimes of passion."
And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because.
QUOTE
As Robin did. He practiced the moral crimes of lying, condescension, arrogance, and willingly held delusions. As a result, he was ostracized from the community in which he was most capable of spreading whatever message he intended to spread, and was vilified during and after his banishment.
And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| As Robin did. He practiced the moral crimes of lying, condescension, arrogance, and willingly held delusions. As a result, he was ostracized from the community in which he was most capable of spreading whatever message he intended to spread, and was vilified during and after his banishment. |
And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect.
It is also an IDEALIZED idea. In other words, it has certain characteristics which make it appealing, but is not a practical solution to the various problems we face.
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution. Myself and many others are putting this to the test. We are many more than perhaps would seem the case. We have seen the need for a higher love, and have chosen to place it at the table where rationality is discoursed. I would like to see if it can be further accepted as a practical solution to various problems we face.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
QUOTE
That is not a quote from jesus. That IS the sort of thing he MIGHT have said.
This, in and of itself is a lie, are you aware of that? Misquoting someone is the same as claiming they've said that which they haven't, a lie.
This, in and of itself is a lie, are you aware of that? Misquoting someone is the same as claiming they've said that which they haven't, a lie.
My apologies. You are correct, it is a quote accredited to have been said by Jesus.
Hi Marley,
the post by Trippy is exceedingly important for one on a spiritual path to follow, as you have indicated you have chosen to do.
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs.
Practicing unconditional love, and enabling forgiveness, is not employed to heal all wrongs in others, it is employed to heal all wrongs in oneself. If you can do that, it's miracle enough. Keep reading. Ultimately, it's what one says to oneself, and if it's truly learned, what one does within their sphere with those they meet.
the post by Trippy is exceedingly important for one on a spiritual path to follow, as you have indicated you have chosen to do.
QUOTE
You can not change someone if they do not wish to change.
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| You can not change someone if they do not wish to change. |
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:The time has come to unashamedly practice an unconditional type of love, because it will be the power to heal all wrongs.
Practicing unconditional love, and enabling forgiveness, is not employed to heal all wrongs in others, it is employed to heal all wrongs in oneself. If you can do that, it's miracle enough. Keep reading. Ultimately, it's what one says to oneself, and if it's truly learned, what one does within their sphere with those they meet.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 01:23 PM)
That I have every faith in as being a certain way toward helping to release someone from their problems. Not to get drawn in by it, or to support it, but to stand back. And it can be turned on its head by saying that we protect our own problems by supporting the same ones in others. If we project that kind of spirit, we see something similar to the world in which we live in, fragmented and becoming damaged.
The position from which you are arguing is -in and of itself- a judgment of everyone who disagrees with you, in that you say what we have done is wrong. None of us are judging you in this manner, which is why we have limited our argument to defending our actions. If you truly wish to see where we stand, view your own feedback page. By coming here and arguing with us, many would believe that you are making enemies, and your feedback page is evidence of the fact that all of us are capable of disagreeing (strongly, even) with your position without drawing you into it. I would then ask you to review parson's posting history, and see for yourself that he was not merely one who disagreed with us, but one who actively insulted, berated, judged and lied to us. He engaged in every form of hypocrisy imaginable, as well as telling blatant lies, demonstrating bigotry, and making hordes of ridiculous and unverifiable claims, not to mention the mind-numbing amount of logical fallacies present in his post. If you can read through his posting history and still not understand why we feel our reaction to him was justified, then I'm afraid it's time for you to turn your judgment inward, and try to realize that your perceptions about morality and criminality are in sore need of a dose of reality. This is not a judgment of you, merely an opinion that you do not know the full extent of Robin's behavior here, and thus are assuming him to have been more reasonable and socially adept than he really was.
Your post did not indicate any such awareness.
Your post did not indicate any such awareness.
No, this thing called "form" is the very thing that is changing in some people's minds. We now are becoming aware of the conciousness within the form. we are not the form. So to reform something is only to catapult it into some other condional awareness. Look up, if you so wish, the idea of the Seven Rays. Again I am not saying I support what this view is about, I simply have gained some helpful insights from it.
That sounds like new-age pseudo-mysticism to me, and not like psychology. If you wish to change the real world, you MUST address the real world, and not some hypothetical description of it.
I know for a fact that it can be done.
I know for a fact that it can be done.
And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because.
Not all crimes of passion are committed because the victim expresses a desire to leave the criminal. Not even most. Many are simply unconditional love fueling a spark of anger generated in some argument.
I personally don't subscribe to the theory of "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." If such were to be implemented in any moral or legal system, then there would be no punishment, for there are no perfect people. Instead, a consensus must be reached among many different people, and the implemented. That is the nature of both the United States criminal justice system and what happened to Robin.
I personally don't subscribe to the theory of "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." If such were to be implemented in any moral or legal system, then there would be no punishment, for there are no perfect people. Instead, a consensus must be reached among many different people, and the implemented. That is the nature of both the United States criminal justice system and what happened to Robin.
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution.
Then you must show how such is possible in the real world. You have just made an extraordinary claim, thus you must provide extraordinary proof.
I can tell you from experience and common wisdom that what you are attempting is an exercise in futility. You must first demonstrate that such is possible. Then you must convince every single person on earth to subscriber to your views. Then you must somehow prevent people from publicly espousing and privately violating this view. It is simply impossible.
The position from which you are arguing is -in and of itself- a judgment of everyone who disagrees with you, in that you say what we have done is wrong. None of us are judging you in this manner, which is why we have limited our argument to defending our actions. If you truly wish to see where we stand, view your own feedback page. By coming here and arguing with us, many would believe that you are making enemies, and your feedback page is evidence of the fact that all of us are capable of disagreeing (strongly, even) with your position without drawing you into it. I would then ask you to review parson's posting history, and see for yourself that he was not merely one who disagreed with us, but one who actively insulted, berated, judged and lied to us. He engaged in every form of hypocrisy imaginable, as well as telling blatant lies, demonstrating bigotry, and making hordes of ridiculous and unverifiable claims, not to mention the mind-numbing amount of logical fallacies present in his post. If you can read through his posting history and still not understand why we feel our reaction to him was justified, then I'm afraid it's time for you to turn your judgment inward, and try to realize that your perceptions about morality and criminality are in sore need of a dose of reality. This is not a judgment of you, merely an opinion that you do not know the full extent of Robin's behavior here, and thus are assuming him to have been more reasonable and socially adept than he really was.
QUOTE
Thank you, I was aware of that.
Your post did not indicate any such awareness.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Thank you, I was aware of that. |
Your post did not indicate any such awareness.
No, this thing called "form" is the very thing that is changing in some people's minds. We now are becoming aware of the conciousness within the form. we are not the form. So to reform something is only to catapult it into some other condional awareness. Look up, if you so wish, the idea of the Seven Rays. Again I am not saying I support what this view is about, I simply have gained some helpful insights from it.
That sounds like new-age pseudo-mysticism to me, and not like psychology. If you wish to change the real world, you MUST address the real world, and not some hypothetical description of it.
QUOTE
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
I know for a fact that it can be done.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure. |
I know for a fact that it can be done.
And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because.
Not all crimes of passion are committed because the victim expresses a desire to leave the criminal. Not even most. Many are simply unconditional love fueling a spark of anger generated in some argument.
QUOTE
And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect.
I personally don't subscribe to the theory of "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." If such were to be implemented in any moral or legal system, then there would be no punishment, for there are no perfect people. Instead, a consensus must be reached among many different people, and the implemented. That is the nature of both the United States criminal justice system and what happened to Robin.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| And who were these sinless people that threw the first stones? Have you lied, been arrogant etc? I don't mean you personally. if you haven't commtited any of these things you are condemning someone else for, you have my utmost respect. |
I personally don't subscribe to the theory of "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." If such were to be implemented in any moral or legal system, then there would be no punishment, for there are no perfect people. Instead, a consensus must be reached among many different people, and the implemented. That is the nature of both the United States criminal justice system and what happened to Robin.
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution.
Then you must show how such is possible in the real world. You have just made an extraordinary claim, thus you must provide extraordinary proof.
QUOTE
Myself and many others are putting this to the test. We are many more than perhaps would seem the case. We have seen the need for a higher love, and have chosen to place it at the table where rationality is discoursed. I would like to see if it can be further accepted as a practical solution to various problems we face.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
I can tell you from experience and common wisdom that what you are attempting is an exercise in futility. You must first demonstrate that such is possible. Then you must convince every single person on earth to subscriber to your views. Then you must somehow prevent people from publicly espousing and privately violating this view. It is simply impossible.
QUOTE (marley+)
I prefer the idea of controlling ones emotions, rather than allowing them to control us. It can be achieved, of that I'm quite sure.
I agree. That is one of the simplest rules to live by, but it isn't always easy to do.
The first example wouldn't be unconditional love. That would be selfishness.
The first example wouldn't be unconditional love. That would be selfishness.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
It can only be helpful to a certain point.
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution. Myself and many others are putting this to the test. We are many more than perhaps would seem the case. We have seen the need for a higher love, and have chosen to place it at the table where rationality is discoursed. I would like to see if it can be further accepted as a practical solution to various problems we face.
In my experience it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
Wow...guys I really have to say that I am completely and totally with Marley in that we should all be loving Robin. He is a pain in the butt, yes, and most of the time, this is true. But honestly I never ever wished any harm to come to him and always felt that I cared for the guy.
To call what I felt love, well I gave him my attentions and tried to better him in the end. When I ignored him that was not as nice as the other I think. Ignoring someone is to remove validation...I suggested we do this as well because he was rather out of control with the same crappy arguments all of the time but.. Still, what is attention but a form of love? There was some spite, there was some anger and animosity on my part, but it is like having an irritating family member, you argue because you care at least a little.
I see nothing wrong in the way marley approaches this subject, especially for someone who is of a spiritual mindset. And I was a bit shocked that anyone would think this could be Parsons. I love Mr. P even though he is deluded and smells conspiracy round every corner, I love him in his weakness, I have always cared about him and felt some empathy/sympathy. I care for anyone that I am sharing the fabric of space/time with...why wouldn't I? There is nothing wrong with loving our fellow man, no matter how sick or "messed up" they may be.
You folks should see me when I am off my rocker...not at all pretty I suppose! You must remember that I will place myself above no one in the long run. I have had NINE psychotic breaks from reality. Nine of them, I am a crazy person for real...and if I met Robin in a mental facility I would be nice to him no matter how deluded...no matter how crotchety...I would see him and understand that his life has put him in this place, so it must have been very rocky and like my own.
I argued with Robin not because I didn't like him, not because I didn't love him...but because he was often wrong and was begging for correction. Unstable folks are not any less lovable than, lets say a child with a mental deficit, they may be ever so much more irritating (or not, depending if you are the ultimate caretaker) but they are no less deserving of love and affection. I do feel affection for Mr. Parsons. I feel the empathy he so readily professed to understand and aspired to feel. He is a human being with problems. We should all try to understand what an outside party is trying to get at. Maybe we all did some disservice to Parsons when treating him as if he had all his marbles together. Maybe everyone could have been a little kinder to him.
Poor guy is begging for attention and that attention equals love. I now wish that I had been a more understanding party. I should have continued to ignore him if I nothing of value to contribute to him as a person. I wish I had continued to lay low and just not read him because he did begin to irritate me to no end, and then I would eventually blast him with negativity. And expecting him to be positive after was ludicrous at best.
All that stuff about him being able to harm anyone is also ridiculous. He couldn't use his mind to harm a flea. He is too caught up in his drama to be able to focus his mind. I do know something about the ability to communicate telepathically...I have done it and it carrys no threat to someone who is not open to receiving messages. If one feels vulnerable to Mr. Parsons, and what he could do mentally, please be reassured it is next to nothing. We are all protected from these things. If someone could harm others (as in witchcraft) just by thinking we would all be in a world of trouble with every person who didn't like us. Life just does not facilitate that way, to evil in my opinion. In other words, life does not appear to serve "evil" in this manner!
I am NOT implying that Parsons was evil, just making an opinionated statement about certain mental abilities. If anyone thinks that Parsons is truly evil raise your hand.
I think he merely needed something he was not being given in his outer life, as I do. Namely attention from those he felt were his peers. Possibly some form of respect for whatever it is he has done, and a persecution complex, left him very dissatisfied there. And friendship which he felt a little of in lighthearted moments and threads. And even argument or excited debate, to feel he has an effect on people. To feel that he is alive and not fading away in some shelter, heading for the doorstep of death and having left little of value behind.
I am in need of some of those things too, and I think that I understand him a little, relate to him a bit even. I enjoy a feeling that I am not fading away, with very few friends (in the outside world) and that some people appreciate me in here even though I am not sophisticated, learned, or a scientist (not even in the making).
I hope you will take into consideration that we may have abused someone who didn't need more than an understanding ear. I think I may have been harsh on too many occasions against my better judgment, and that I owe Mr. P an apology for some of the things I intimated or said.
I will say it here. Robin I fear I have misunderstood you and being called to task by a brother who understands the value of a loving heart, I apologize to you for times I fell victim to anger and the easy way out and fought over silly non-sensical things with you. You and I are human and we are prone to make mistakes. I will be sure to be more careful if you return to this forum, and either not allow you to get on my nerves, by remembering you are my fellow man, or to stay out of the conversations which involve anything volatile or enter into any harsh thinking about you just because others have.
That said I think you owe anyone you have hurt or belittled in here an apology as well, especially THEY who was actually scared of your potential to do harm with your mind alone. (At least one believed you could do so, amounting to a faith in your abilities.) I will close with this. I have never not loved you, I felt you were a brother who was at times abusive and out of control. But I loved you. I love you now. I still think you are in need of some help with your persecution complex. And I hope you will look into becoming a less threatened individual...and equally less threatening to others.
~PEACE~
I agree. That is one of the simplest rules to live by, but it isn't always easy to do.
QUOTE
And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because.
The first example wouldn't be unconditional love. That would be selfishness.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| And these are performed through unconditional love? I hear more the "if I can't have you then no one else can"...if if if, conditions, "I killed him/her because. |
The first example wouldn't be unconditional love. That would be selfishness.
In my expierence it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
It can only be helpful to a certain point.
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 12 2008, 06:49 PM)
The position from which you are arguing is -in and of itself- a judgement of everyone who disagrees with you, in that you say what we have done is wrong. None of us are judging you in this manner, which is why we have limited our argument to defending our actions. If you truly wish to see where we stand, view your own feedback page. By coming here and arguing with us, many would believe that you are making enemies, and your feedback page is evidence of the fact that all of us are capable of disagreeing (strongly, even) with your position without drawing you into it. I would then ask you to review parson's posting history, and se for yourself that he was not merely one who disagreed with us, but one who actively insulted, berated, judged and lied to us. He engaged in every form of hypocrisy imaginable, as well as telling blatant lies, demonstrating bigotry, and making hoardes of ridiculous and unverifiable claims, not to mention the mind-numbing amount of logical fallacies present in his post. If you can read through his posting history and still not understand why we feel our reaction to him was justified, then I'm afraid it's time for you to turn your judgement inward, and try to realize that your perceptions about morality and criminality are in sore need of a dose of reality. This is not a judgement of you, merely an opinion that you do not know the full extent of Robin's behavior here, and thus are assuming him to have been more reasonable and socially adept than he really was.
Most eloquently delivered ... nice!
Most eloquently delivered ... nice!
QUOTE (soundhertz+Mar 12 2008, 06:49 PM)
Hi Marley,
the post by Trippy is exceedingly important for one on a spiritual path to follow, as you have indicated you have chosen to do.
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:
Practicing unconditional love, and enabling forgiveness, is not employed to heal all wrongs in others, it is employed to heal all wrongs in oneself. If you can do that, it's miracle enough. Keep reading. Ultimately, it's what one says to oneself, and if it's truly learned, what one does within their sphere with those they meet.
We are in full agreement. I have already stated I don't wish to change anyone. Also, I mentioned that we heal ourselves, through self forgiveness in many repsects. So, imagine practicing this uncondional love and producing the ground within that heals all wroings. And then by simply holding onto this ground it will also affect that around one's perosn.
the post by Trippy is exceedingly important for one on a spiritual path to follow, as you have indicated you have chosen to do.
Because love cannot coerce.
You said:
Practicing unconditional love, and enabling forgiveness, is not employed to heal all wrongs in others, it is employed to heal all wrongs in oneself. If you can do that, it's miracle enough. Keep reading. Ultimately, it's what one says to oneself, and if it's truly learned, what one does within their sphere with those they meet.
We are in full agreement. I have already stated I don't wish to change anyone. Also, I mentioned that we heal ourselves, through self forgiveness in many repsects. So, imagine practicing this uncondional love and producing the ground within that heals all wroings. And then by simply holding onto this ground it will also affect that around one's perosn.
I just finished editing my previous post. Please re-read, anyone who's interested.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 06:42 PM)
My apologies. You are correct, it is a quote accredited to have been said by Jesus.
... So, Santa is accredited to have said "Ho ho ho" - fictional characters say lots of catch-phrase stuff .... your point?
... So, Santa is accredited to have said "Ho ho ho" - fictional characters say lots of catch-phrase stuff .... your point?
QUOTE (marley+Mar 13 2008, 07:54 AM)
We are in full agreement. I have already stated I don't wish to change anyone. Also, I mentioned that we heal ourselves, through self forgiveness in many repsects. So, imagine practicing this uncondional love and producing the ground within that heals all wroings. And then by simply holding onto this ground it will also affect that around one's perosn.
Then practice what you preach and show your love for others, by allowing them to dislike those they choose not to respect.
You can not love someone if you do not love yourself.
You can not love someone you do not respect.
Parsons had choices in all of this as well.
He chose the path he walked down.
The fact that he claims to be a victim demonstrates two things.
1) He did not recognize the choices when he was presented with them.
2) He can not accept responsibility for his role in the events.
Then practice what you preach and show your love for others, by allowing them to dislike those they choose not to respect.
You can not love someone if you do not love yourself.
You can not love someone you do not respect.
Parsons had choices in all of this as well.
He chose the path he walked down.
The fact that he claims to be a victim demonstrates two things.
1) He did not recognize the choices when he was presented with them.
2) He can not accept responsibility for his role in the events.
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 12 2008, 06:49 PM)
The position from which you are arguing is -in and of itself- a judgement of everyone who disagrees with you, in that you say what we have done is wrong. None of us are judging you in this manner, which is why we have limited our argument to defending our actions. If you truly wish to see where we stand, view your own feedback page. By coming here and arguing with us, many would believe that you are making enemies, and your feedback page is evidence of the fact that all of us are capable of disagreeing (strongly, even) with your position without drawing you into it. I would then ask you to review parson's posting history, and se for yourself that he was not merely one who disagreed with us, but one who actively insulted, berated, judged and lied to us. He engaged in every form of hypocrisy imaginable, as well as telling blatant lies, demonstrating bigotry, and making hoardes of ridiculous and unverifiable claims, not to mention the mind-numbing amount of logical fallacies present in his post. If you can read through his posting history and still not understand why we feel our reaction to him was justified, then I'm afraid it's time for you to turn your judgement inward, and try to realize that your perceptions about morality and criminality are in sore need of a dose of reality. This is not a judgement of you, merely an opinion that you do not know the full extent of Robin's behavior here, and thus are assuming him to have been more reasonable and socially adept than he really was.
You have taken my impersonal statement and applied it to your own situation with Robin here? Whether or not a group of people can feel justified in their actions collectively, is not my interest actually. And I think, somewhere along the line I must have given the impression I am about focusing on wrongs. Apologies for that. I am the opposite to this. I am sorry if you feel I am criticising you over this Robin affair.
When I realized that I had committed enough poor actions in life to warrant
me as having failed perfection, I dropped all the stones. I now forgive myself, and want to make up for my errors, because I realized I was not being judged by the great spirit living within us. It's love was unconditional (regardless of what priests like to say). The same love the great creator has for all things. And it is an image of itself given to me, and I want to become it fully. It is a fullness I would wish on myself, you, others and even Robin! I agree, this experience with this man has left some of you upset. I have not had the same experience, but I have been in similar situations, so I can understand the strength of feeling.
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
You have taken my impersonal statement and applied it to your own situation with Robin here? Whether or not a group of people can feel justified in their actions collectively, is not my interest actually. And I think, somewhere along the line I must have given the impression I am about focusing on wrongs. Apologies for that. I am the opposite to this. I am sorry if you feel I am criticising you over this Robin affair.
When I realized that I had committed enough poor actions in life to warrant
me as having failed perfection, I dropped all the stones. I now forgive myself, and want to make up for my errors, because I realized I was not being judged by the great spirit living within us. It's love was unconditional (regardless of what priests like to say). The same love the great creator has for all things. And it is an image of itself given to me, and I want to become it fully. It is a fullness I would wish on myself, you, others and even Robin! I agree, this experience with this man has left some of you upset. I have not had the same experience, but I have been in similar situations, so I can understand the strength of feeling.
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
QUOTE (marley+)
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
Irrelevant. This is about humans loving unconditionally, not God.
Irrelevant. This is about humans loving unconditionally, not God.
I'd also like to point out (to Marley) that Love does not consist exclusively of the touchy-feely-doogoody-bull-crap that he(?) seems to think it does.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
QUOTE (Trippy+Mar 12 2008, 07:26 PM)
I'd also like to point out (to Marley) that Love does not consist exclusively of the touchy-feely-doogoody-bull-crap that he(?) seems to think it does.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
Excellent point, Trip. That is IMO a perfect example of how love can take many forms.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
Excellent point, Trip. That is IMO a perfect example of how love can take many forms.
Am I the only one who thinks that reading marley's posts is like putting a chainsaw to your skull?
It's not THAT bad, Max....
Not yet, anyway.
Not yet, anyway.
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 10:42 AM)
I agree, it is an ideal and a vision. I don't agree , however, that it is not a practical solution. Myself and many others are putting this to the test. We are many more than perhaps would seem the case. We have seen the need for a higher love, and have chosen to place it at the table where rationality is discoursed. I would like to see if it can be further accepted as a practical solution to various problems we face.
In my experience it is indeed a very helpful force, very much mis-understood and confused for emotional kinds of conditional love.
When I don't live up to that ideal, I try again.
Wow...guys I really have to say that I am completely and totally with Marley in that we should all be loving Robin. He is a pain in the butt, yes, and most of the time, this is true. But honestly I never ever wished any harm to come to him and always felt that I cared for the guy.
To call what I felt love, well I gave him my attentions and tried to better him in the end. When I ignored him that was not as nice as the other I think. Ignoring someone is to remove validation...I suggested we do this as well because he was rather out of control with the same crappy arguments all of the time but.. Still, what is attention but a form of love? There was some spite, there was some anger and animosity on my part, but it is like having an irritating family member, you argue because you care at least a little.
I see nothing wrong in the way marley approaches this subject, especially for someone who is of a spiritual mindset. And I was a bit shocked that anyone would think this could be Parsons. I love Mr. P even though he is deluded and smells conspiracy round every corner, I love him in his weakness, I have always cared about him and felt some empathy/sympathy. I care for anyone that I am sharing the fabric of space/time with...why wouldn't I? There is nothing wrong with loving our fellow man, no matter how sick or "messed up" they may be.
You folks should see me when I am off my rocker...not at all pretty I suppose! You must remember that I will place myself above no one in the long run. I have had NINE psychotic breaks from reality. Nine of them, I am a crazy person for real...and if I met Robin in a mental facility I would be nice to him no matter how deluded...no matter how crotchety...I would see him and understand that his life has put him in this place, so it must have been very rocky and like my own.
I argued with Robin not because I didn't like him, not because I didn't love him...but because he was often wrong and was begging for correction. Unstable folks are not any less lovable than, lets say a child with a mental deficit, they may be ever so much more irritating (or not, depending if you are the ultimate caretaker) but they are no less deserving of love and affection. I do feel affection for Mr. Parsons. I feel the empathy he so readily professed to understand and aspired to feel. He is a human being with problems. We should all try to understand what an outside party is trying to get at. Maybe we all did some disservice to Parsons when treating him as if he had all his marbles together. Maybe everyone could have been a little kinder to him.
Poor guy is begging for attention and that attention equals love. I now wish that I had been a more understanding party. I should have continued to ignore him if I nothing of value to contribute to him as a person. I wish I had continued to lay low and just not read him because he did begin to irritate me to no end, and then I would eventually blast him with negativity. And expecting him to be positive after was ludicrous at best.
All that stuff about him being able to harm anyone is also ridiculous. He couldn't use his mind to harm a flea. He is too caught up in his drama to be able to focus his mind. I do know something about the ability to communicate telepathically...I have done it and it carrys no threat to someone who is not open to receiving messages. If one feels vulnerable to Mr. Parsons, and what he could do mentally, please be reassured it is next to nothing. We are all protected from these things. If someone could harm others (as in witchcraft) just by thinking we would all be in a world of trouble with every person who didn't like us. Life just does not facilitate that way, to evil in my opinion. In other words, life does not appear to serve "evil" in this manner!
I am NOT implying that Parsons was evil, just making an opinionated statement about certain mental abilities. If anyone thinks that Parsons is truly evil raise your hand.
I think he merely needed something he was not being given in his outer life, as I do. Namely attention from those he felt were his peers. Possibly some form of respect for whatever it is he has done, and a persecution complex, left him very dissatisfied there. And friendship which he felt a little of in lighthearted moments and threads. And even argument or excited debate, to feel he has an effect on people. To feel that he is alive and not fading away in some shelter, heading for the doorstep of death and having left little of value behind.I am in need of some of those things too, and I think that I understand him a little, relate to him a bit even. I enjoy a feeling that I am not fading away, with very few friends (in the outside world) and that some people appreciate me in here even though I am not sophisticated, learned, or a scientist (not even in the making).
I hope you will take into consideration that we may have abused someone who didn't need more than an understanding ear. I think I may have been harsh on too many occasions against my better judgment, and that I owe Mr. P an apology for some of the things I intimated or said.
I will say it here. Robin I fear I have misunderstood you and being called to task by a brother who understands the value of a loving heart, I apologize to you for times I fell victim to anger and the easy way out and fought over silly non-sensical things with you. You and I are human and we are prone to make mistakes. I will be sure to be more careful if you return to this forum, and either not allow you to get on my nerves, by remembering you are my fellow man, or to stay out of the conversations which involve anything volatile or enter into any harsh thinking about you just because others have.
That said I think you owe anyone you have hurt or belittled in here an apology as well, especially THEY who was actually scared of your potential to do harm with your mind alone. (At least one believed you could do so, amounting to a faith in your abilities.) I will close with this. I have never not loved you, I felt you were a brother who was at times abusive and out of control. But I loved you. I love you now. I still think you are in need of some help with your persecution complex. And I hope you will look into becoming a less threatened individual...and equally less threatening to others.
~PEACE~
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 02:19 PM)
You have taken my impersonal statement and applied it to your own situation with Robin here? Whether or not a group of people can feel justified in their actions collectively, is not my interest actually. And I think, somewhere along the line I must have given the impression I am about focusing on wrongs. Apologies for that. I am the opposite to this. I am sorry if you feel I am criticising you over this Robin affair.
Your position IS critical, whether you intend to be critical or not.
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
I now forgive myself, and want to make up for my errors,
That statement indicates that you have not, as you've claimed, abandoned the act of judging. If you cannot judge others, you cannot judge yourself. (What standards would you judge yourself by, if not by the standards set by others?)
I think such would be an accurate (albiet grossly incomplete) description of an omnipotent being. But living hitler does not mean that God would forgive him, without punishment.
Absent punishment, why would anyone do the right thing? Very very few people do what is right for the sake of what is right. Ironically enough, most of them are NOT religious.
All in all, we would all prefer Robin to have been a rational, intelligent, honest man, but he made the hcoice not to be, and so he must either accept the consequences of such, or forever be in the wrong.
Your position IS critical, whether you intend to be critical or not.
QUOTE
When I realized that I had committed enough poor actions in life to warrant
me as having failed perfection, I dropped all the stones.
me as having failed perfection, I dropped all the stones.
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| When I realized that I had committed enough poor actions in life to warrant me as having failed perfection, I dropped all the stones. |
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
I now forgive myself, and want to make up for my errors,
That statement indicates that you have not, as you've claimed, abandoned the act of judging. If you cannot judge others, you cannot judge yourself. (What standards would you judge yourself by, if not by the standards set by others?)
QUOTE
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
I think such would be an accurate (albiet grossly incomplete) description of an omnipotent being. But living hitler does not mean that God would forgive him, without punishment.
Absent punishment, why would anyone do the right thing? Very very few people do what is right for the sake of what is right. Ironically enough, most of them are NOT religious.
All in all, we would all prefer Robin to have been a rational, intelligent, honest man, but he made the hcoice not to be, and so he must either accept the consequences of such, or forever be in the wrong.
QUOTE (TheDoc+Mar 12 2008, 07:41 PM)
Not yet, anyway.
I beg to differ.
I beg to differ.
QUOTE (tikay+)
But honestly I never ever wished any harm to come to him and always felt that I cared for the guy.
Even after he threatened you?
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
They don't get lobotomies in the first place - there's nothing to lobotomize.
- Gehn
Even after he threatened you?
QUOTE (<Max>+)
I beg to differ.
You really think so?
You really think so?
Seeing as how I am a fallible human I am not capable of always returning kindness to people. Some people "make" me want to be mean to them.. either by their stupidity, arrogance, condescending tone or just stubbornness. (Not to mention that some people are just hard to like.)
As a result of this shortcoming in myself, I sometimes have no choice but to walk away. (Usually after giving them a few pokes with a sharp stick...)
As a result of this shortcoming in myself, I sometimes have no choice but to walk away. (Usually after giving them a few pokes with a sharp stick...)
QUOTE (TheDoc+Mar 12 2008, 07:46 PM)
You really think so?
For fucksake:
For fucksake:
QUOTE
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
Hmm. You may have a point.
QUOTE (<Max>+Mar 13 2008, 08:39 AM)
Am I the only one who thinks that reading marley's posts is like putting a chainsaw to your skull?
I agree. He has to be one of the most irritating posters I have ever seen. I'm just going to ignore him.
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
I agree. He has to be one of the most irritating posters I have ever seen. I'm just going to ignore him.
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
QUOTE (N O M+Mar 12 2008, 08:34 PM)
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
They don't get lobotomies in the first place - there's nothing to lobotomize.
- Gehn
You guys REALLY need to stop using this damn invisible text...
It's making my head spin!
It's making my head spin!
QUOTE (TheDoc+Mar 12 2008, 11:46 AM)
QUOTE (tikay+)
But honestly I never ever wished any harm to come to him and always felt that I cared for the guy.
Even after he threatened you?
Even after he threatened you?
QUOTE (<Max>+)
I beg to differ.
You really think so?
In my mind the man never threatened me in any way...he was/is delusional.
You really think so?
In my mind the man never threatened me in any way...he was/is delusional.
QUOTE (tikay+)
In my mind the man never threatened me in any way
Yes, he did.
Yes, he did.
QUOTE (Parsons in tikay's feedback+)
Thanks for the valentine but (I) really don't like what your saying in that moon hoax thread...please be more careful.
Sounds like a threat to me.
Sounds like a threat to me.
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+)
You guys REALLY need to stop using this damn invisible text...
It's making my head spin!
Too bad!
It's making my head spin!
Too bad!
Telling me to be more careful is not a threat it was a request (he was polite enough to say please as well). He was terribly offended that I was sort of sitting on the fence for a while there. I guess it is emotional for some while it was not for me, it was merely interesting.
He may have threated people with lawsuits but I was astonished that anyone ever took him seriously in any form of threatening. He is a man with no means to follow through on such threats, and had no grounds in the first place. All that libel and slander crap was unfounded. He simply needed to feel important, in my summation.
He may have threated people with lawsuits but I was astonished that anyone ever took him seriously in any form of threatening. He is a man with no means to follow through on such threats, and had no grounds in the first place. All that libel and slander crap was unfounded. He simply needed to feel important, in my summation.
Latest news from Robbie The Bum:
Blog
QUOTE
In my life (I) don't wonder about my recognition factor locally, it shows.
Last time it was two students who, while passing by me one asked of the other a well timed question of 'just What is that degree your getting' responded to with 'A degree in Mathematical Physics'...so you know it is a-in reference to me as per what just transpired on the Physorg Forums boards and my asking one of the other posters about Riemannian n'th dimensional manifold tensors and what he would do if that was NOT the manner of operation of (gravity in) space.
Last time it was two students who, while passing by me one asked of the other a well timed question of 'just What is that degree your getting' responded to with 'A degree in Mathematical Physics'...so you know it is a-in reference to me as per what just transpired on the Physorg Forums boards and my asking one of the other posters about Riemannian n'th dimensional manifold tensors and what he would do if that was NOT the manner of operation of (gravity in) space.
Blog
When someone goes away for a time, I for one, am happy to let them leave. I also hope he does reflect on his time here, while he vacations.
QUOTE (tikay+Mar 13 2008, 12:03 PM)
When someone goes away for a time, I for one, am happy to let them leave. I also hope he does reflect on his time here, while he vacations.
He wont though, because he is incapable of accepting that he might actually have done something wrong.
A point he's proven again, and again, and again.
He refuses to accept ANY responsibility for his actions.
He wont though, because he is incapable of accepting that he might actually have done something wrong.
A point he's proven again, and again, and again.
He refuses to accept ANY responsibility for his actions.
That just goes to show us who we are dealing with and how messed up his thought processes are. I know you have a right to be more offended Trippy, but I very much doubt you are really frightened by this person in any way. What could he do to any of us?
I am not afraid of much of anything...well earthquakes, hurricanes and their counterparts, but not of some old dude on a forum who is a grouchy attention seeking sort. I am not afraid of the neighborhood thugs even....so what would lead me to fear Mr Parsons. I consider him pretty much impotent to cause any real harm to anyone ~ beyond words, that is.
I am not afraid of much of anything...well earthquakes, hurricanes and their counterparts, but not of some old dude on a forum who is a grouchy attention seeking sort. I am not afraid of the neighborhood thugs even....so what would lead me to fear Mr Parsons. I consider him pretty much impotent to cause any real harm to anyone ~ beyond words, that is.
QUOTE (TheDoc+Mar 12 2008, 07:21 PM)
QUOTE (marley+)
What do you think about a God that can love unconditionally? That can love a "hitler" as much as a "saint"?
Irrelevant. This is about humans loving unconditionally, not God.
It's pretty relevant, considering the idea that we are God . It is said that we can be perfect as our father in heaven is perfect. I would add to that word father the word other too. And I would say that what it means is that heaven is the same as perfect, and it is something here and now. And also it is the non practice, non belief of this state of reality that is the only basis for any problems here in this world.
Oooops, Carl Jung , not Carl Yung the Austrian bear tamer.
Oh goodness....
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
'Unconditional love is the only reality'
Now that DOES sound 'overrated'! (Unless this is Derek's 'shadow', trying to prove itself 'right')
g.
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
Now that DOES sound 'overrated'! (Unless this is Derek's 'shadow', trying to prove itself 'right')
g.
Actually just a swift calling, dropping by to see what affect the ideal of unconditional love would have on ego, including mine. The treatment on some schizzophrenic seemed a good a time as any to interupt the flow.
I don't think there is any going down the pan. Religion has never had anything to do with it. Perhaps having a loner lifestyle helps. Either way the future is truly gorgeous.
What is a case of the "dibedys"?
What is a case of the "dibedys"?
It's a sarcastic reference to another member of the forum - it isn't a real disorder.
- Gehn
Irrelevant. This is about humans loving unconditionally, not God.
It's pretty relevant, considering the idea that we are God . It is said that we can be perfect as our father in heaven is perfect. I would add to that word father the word other too. And I would say that what it means is that heaven is the same as perfect, and it is something here and now. And also it is the non practice, non belief of this state of reality that is the only basis for any problems here in this world.
QUOTE (tikay+Mar 13 2008, 12:16 PM)
That just goes to show us who we are dealing with and how messed up his thought processes are. I know you have a right to be more offended Trippy, but I very much doubt you are really frightened by this person in any way. What could he do to any of us?
I am not afraid of much of anything...well earthquakes, hurricanes and their counterparts, but not of some old dude on a forum who is a grouchy attention seeking sort. I am not afraid of the neighborhood thugs even....so what would lead me to fear Mr Parsons. I consider him pretty much impotent to cause any real harm to anyone ~ beyond words, that is.
I don't have to fear someone in order to not respect (or even revile) them.
Parsons earned my loathing when he started abusing me for something that he thought I said to him, and then referred back to that post mutliple times in spite of the fact that I explained a few posts later that the comment had not been directed at him.
This is not the first time this has happened. Parsons has also, on multiple occasions falsely accused me of lying and trying to deliberately mislead, and then starts parading around the forum trumpeting on about users defaming him.
Parsons has, in my opinion, for these reasons, and others, earned every ounce of derision I have, and continue to direct at him.
I am not afraid of much of anything...well earthquakes, hurricanes and their counterparts, but not of some old dude on a forum who is a grouchy attention seeking sort. I am not afraid of the neighborhood thugs even....so what would lead me to fear Mr Parsons. I consider him pretty much impotent to cause any real harm to anyone ~ beyond words, that is.
I don't have to fear someone in order to not respect (or even revile) them.
Parsons earned my loathing when he started abusing me for something that he thought I said to him, and then referred back to that post mutliple times in spite of the fact that I explained a few posts later that the comment had not been directed at him.
This is not the first time this has happened. Parsons has also, on multiple occasions falsely accused me of lying and trying to deliberately mislead, and then starts parading around the forum trumpeting on about users defaming him.
Parsons has, in my opinion, for these reasons, and others, earned every ounce of derision I have, and continue to direct at him.
Correction: Every ounce of Derision that I choose to direct at him.
I aknowledge, that as a free thinking being aware of the decisions I make consciously and subconsciously on a daily basis, that I choose to rise to his antagonism and respond in kind.
That's the difference between me and Parsons (and for that matter me and many of the people I argue with).
I aknowledge, that as a free thinking being aware of the decisions I make consciously and subconsciously on a daily basis, that I choose to rise to his antagonism and respond in kind.
That's the difference between me and Parsons (and for that matter me and many of the people I argue with).
He did those things to everyone...it wasn't personal. It was his illness, it is his debility. Or lack of ability to comprehend isn't it? It is that we are dealing with someone who isn't quite right as I said before. If derision is all that you really feel then feel that and do what you must but, consider that Mr. Parsons does not actually know how to control himself? This is what I am saying...maybe he has the capacity to comprehend and maybe he doesn't. I prefer to think the latter, giving him the benefit of the doubt...this is why i say he is a man out of control. The rest of us, those who do not have the same lack ~ are called to a higher standard, don't you think?
I realize that this may detract from my former apologetic tone but I am trying to make a point in the most honest way I know. I am not retracting my apology for being harsh to Mr. P...I am simply being as honest as possible, in what I truly feel.
I realize that this may detract from my former apologetic tone but I am trying to make a point in the most honest way I know. I am not retracting my apology for being harsh to Mr. P...I am simply being as honest as possible, in what I truly feel.
QUOTE (tikay+Mar 13 2008, 12:40 PM)
He did those things to everyone...it wasn't personal. It was his illness, it is his debility. Or lack of ability to comprehend isn't it? It is that we are dealing with someone who isn't quite right as I said before. If derision is all that you really feel then feel that and do what you must but, consider that Mr. Parsons does not actually know how to control himself? This is what I am saying...maybe he has the capacity to comprehend and maybe he doesn't. I prefer to think the latter, giving him the benefit of the doubt...this is why i say he is a man out of control. The rest of us, those who do not have the same lack ~ are called to a higher standard, don't you think?
However, if we make that assumption - that he's ill, then by his own standards that's still no excuse, because he's not making the effort to overcome his illness, moreover, by not deriding him for being abusive, we're facilitating his choice not to overcome his illness in our complacency.
So why should we hold Parsons to any lower standards then he held others to?
(As proof of this, simply look at some of the comments he left in my feedback, and in BDW's feedback).
However, if we make that assumption - that he's ill, then by his own standards that's still no excuse, because he's not making the effort to overcome his illness, moreover, by not deriding him for being abusive, we're facilitating his choice not to overcome his illness in our complacency.
So why should we hold Parsons to any lower standards then he held others to?
(As proof of this, simply look at some of the comments he left in my feedback, and in BDW's feedback).
QUOTE (Trippy+Mar 12 2008, 07:26 PM)
I'd also like to point out (to Marley) that Love does not consist exclusively of the touchy-feely-doogoody-bull-crap that he(?) seems to think it does.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
I must admit, I am not sure where you get the idea of the goody-doody stuff. Nothing I've said I hope! Yes, love has a side to it that can be very corrective in nature. The idea of going into a sacred temple and overturning the profit making greedy people's stalls , for example. Caring enough for someone or something is exactly why I put myself on the line now about a higher expression of love. I'm ready for it.
Love can be hard and unbending - for example, I, at one time, reported my brother to the police for petty theft, because I love him, and because of that love I was concerned for him and the choices he was making.
I must admit, I am not sure where you get the idea of the goody-doody stuff. Nothing I've said I hope! Yes, love has a side to it that can be very corrective in nature. The idea of going into a sacred temple and overturning the profit making greedy people's stalls , for example. Caring enough for someone or something is exactly why I put myself on the line now about a higher expression of love. I'm ready for it.
I will go look into the feedback. I know he can be a miserable victim and does take his revenge quite easily. I am not asking others to LOVE him. But I am saying that it would not be wrong to try and forgive and understand him better.
QUOTE (tikay+Mar 12 2008, 07:42 PM)
Wow...guys I really have to say that I am completely and totally with Marley in that we should all be loving Robin. He is a pain in the butt, yes, and most of the time, this is true. But honestly I never ever wished any harm to come to him and always felt that I cared for the guy.
To call what I felt love, well I gave him my attentions and tried to better him in the end. When I ignored him that was not as nice as the other I think. Ignoring someone is to remove validation...I suggested we do this as well because he was rather out of control with the same crappy arguments all of the time but.. Still, what is attention but a form of love? There was some spite, there was some anger and animosity on my part, but it is like having an irritating family member, you argue because you care at least a little.
I see nothing wrong in the way marley approaches this subject, especially for someone who is of a spiritual mindset. And I was a bit shocked that anyone would think this could be Parsons. I love Mr. P even though he is deluded and smells conspiracy round every corner, I love him in his weakness, I have always cared about him and felt some empathy/sympathy. I care for anyone that I am sharing the fabric of space/time with...why wouldn't I? There is nothing wrong with loving our fellow man, no matter how sick or "messed up" they may be.
You folks should see me when I am off my rocker...not at all pretty I suppose! You must remember that I will place myself above no one in the long run. I have had NINE psychotic breaks from reality. Nine of them, I am a crazy person for real...and if I met Robin in a mental facility I would be nice to him no matter how deluded...no matter how crotchety...I would see him and understand that his life has put him in this place, so it must have been very rocky and like my own.
I argued with Robin not because I didn't like him, not because I didn't love him...but because he was often wrong and was begging for correction. Unstable folks are not any less lovable than, lets say a child with a mental deficit, they may be ever so much more irritating (or not, depending if you are the ultimate caretaker) but they are no less deserving of love and affection. I do feel affection for Mr. Parsons. I feel the empathy he so readily professed to understand and aspired to feel. He is a human being with problems. We should all try to understand what an outside party is trying to get at. Maybe we all did some disservice to Parsons when treating him as if he had all his marbles together. Maybe everyone could have been a little kinder to him.
Poor guy is begging for attention and that attention equals love. I now wish that I had been a more understanding party. I should have continued to ignore him if I nothing of value to contribute to him as a person. I wish I had continued to lay low and just not read him because he did begin to irritate me to no end, and then I would eventually blast him with negativity. And expecting him to be positive after was ludicrous at best.
All that stuff about him being able to harm anyone is also ridiculous. He couldn't use his mind to harm a flea. He is too caught up in his drama to be able to focus his mind. I do know something about the ability to communicate telepathically...I have done it and it carrys no threat to someone who is not open to receiving messages. If one feels vulnerable to Mr. Parsons, and what he could do mentally, please be reassured it is next to nothing. We are all protected from these things. If someone could harm others (as in witchcraft) just by thinking we would all be in a world of trouble with every person who didn't like us. Life just does not facilitate that way, to evil in my opinion. In other words, life does not appear to serve "evil" in this manner!
I am NOT implying that Parsons was evil, just making an opinionated statement about certain mental abilities. If anyone thinks that Parsons is truly evil raise your hand. I think he merely needed something he was not being given in his outer life, as I do. Namely attention from those he felt were his peers. Possibly some form of respect for whatever it is he has done, and a persecution complex, left him very dissatisfied there. And friendship which he felt a little of in lighthearted moments and threads. And even argument or excited debate, to feel he has an effect on people. To feel that he is alive and not fading away in some shelter, heading for the doorstep of death and having left little of value behind.
I am in need of some of those things too, and I think that I understand him a little, relate to him a bit even. I enjoy a feeling that I am not fading away, with very few friends (in the outside world) and that some people appreciate me in here even though I am not sophisticated, learned, or a scientist (not even in the making).
I hope you will take into consideration that we may have abused someone who didn't need more than an understanding ear. I think I may have been harsh on too many occasions against my better judgment, and that I owe Mr. P an apology for some of the things I intimated or said.
I will say it here. Robin I fear I have misunderstood you and being called to task by a brother who understands the value of a loving heart, I apologize to you for times I fell victim to anger and the easy way out and fought over silly non-sensical things with you. You and I are human and we are prone to make mistakes. I will be sure to be more careful if you return to this forum, and either not allow you to get on my nerves, by remembering you are my fellow man, or to stay out of the conversations which involve anything volatile or enter into any harsh thinking about you just because others have.
That said I think you owe anyone you have hurt or belittled in here an apology as well, especially THEY who was actually scared of your potential to do harm with your mind alone. (At least one believed you could do so, amounting to a faith in your abilities.) I will close with this. I have never not loved you, I felt you were a brother who was at times abusive and out of control. But I loved you. I love you now. I still think you are in need of some help with your persecution complex. And I hope you will look into becoming a less threatened individual...and equally less threatening to others.
~PEACE~
Tikay
If I could I would give you ten positives for expressing these sentiments. As Carl Yung would say, you are a Queen in the making. Look out for "him" in your dreams, the man you feel so drawn towards and yet have not met before. He is your anima sancta.
To call what I felt love, well I gave him my attentions and tried to better him in the end. When I ignored him that was not as nice as the other I think. Ignoring someone is to remove validation...I suggested we do this as well because he was rather out of control with the same crappy arguments all of the time but.. Still, what is attention but a form of love? There was some spite, there was some anger and animosity on my part, but it is like having an irritating family member, you argue because you care at least a little.
I see nothing wrong in the way marley approaches this subject, especially for someone who is of a spiritual mindset. And I was a bit shocked that anyone would think this could be Parsons. I love Mr. P even though he is deluded and smells conspiracy round every corner, I love him in his weakness, I have always cared about him and felt some empathy/sympathy. I care for anyone that I am sharing the fabric of space/time with...why wouldn't I? There is nothing wrong with loving our fellow man, no matter how sick or "messed up" they may be.
You folks should see me when I am off my rocker...not at all pretty I suppose! You must remember that I will place myself above no one in the long run. I have had NINE psychotic breaks from reality. Nine of them, I am a crazy person for real...and if I met Robin in a mental facility I would be nice to him no matter how deluded...no matter how crotchety...I would see him and understand that his life has put him in this place, so it must have been very rocky and like my own.
I argued with Robin not because I didn't like him, not because I didn't love him...but because he was often wrong and was begging for correction. Unstable folks are not any less lovable than, lets say a child with a mental deficit, they may be ever so much more irritating (or not, depending if you are the ultimate caretaker) but they are no less deserving of love and affection. I do feel affection for Mr. Parsons. I feel the empathy he so readily professed to understand and aspired to feel. He is a human being with problems. We should all try to understand what an outside party is trying to get at. Maybe we all did some disservice to Parsons when treating him as if he had all his marbles together. Maybe everyone could have been a little kinder to him.
Poor guy is begging for attention and that attention equals love. I now wish that I had been a more understanding party. I should have continued to ignore him if I nothing of value to contribute to him as a person. I wish I had continued to lay low and just not read him because he did begin to irritate me to no end, and then I would eventually blast him with negativity. And expecting him to be positive after was ludicrous at best.
All that stuff about him being able to harm anyone is also ridiculous. He couldn't use his mind to harm a flea. He is too caught up in his drama to be able to focus his mind. I do know something about the ability to communicate telepathically...I have done it and it carrys no threat to someone who is not open to receiving messages. If one feels vulnerable to Mr. Parsons, and what he could do mentally, please be reassured it is next to nothing. We are all protected from these things. If someone could harm others (as in witchcraft) just by thinking we would all be in a world of trouble with every person who didn't like us. Life just does not facilitate that way, to evil in my opinion. In other words, life does not appear to serve "evil" in this manner!
I am NOT implying that Parsons was evil, just making an opinionated statement about certain mental abilities. If anyone thinks that Parsons is truly evil raise your hand.
I think he merely needed something he was not being given in his outer life, as I do. Namely attention from those he felt were his peers. Possibly some form of respect for whatever it is he has done, and a persecution complex, left him very dissatisfied there. And friendship which he felt a little of in lighthearted moments and threads. And even argument or excited debate, to feel he has an effect on people. To feel that he is alive and not fading away in some shelter, heading for the doorstep of death and having left little of value behind.I am in need of some of those things too, and I think that I understand him a little, relate to him a bit even. I enjoy a feeling that I am not fading away, with very few friends (in the outside world) and that some people appreciate me in here even though I am not sophisticated, learned, or a scientist (not even in the making).
I hope you will take into consideration that we may have abused someone who didn't need more than an understanding ear. I think I may have been harsh on too many occasions against my better judgment, and that I owe Mr. P an apology for some of the things I intimated or said.
I will say it here. Robin I fear I have misunderstood you and being called to task by a brother who understands the value of a loving heart, I apologize to you for times I fell victim to anger and the easy way out and fought over silly non-sensical things with you. You and I are human and we are prone to make mistakes. I will be sure to be more careful if you return to this forum, and either not allow you to get on my nerves, by remembering you are my fellow man, or to stay out of the conversations which involve anything volatile or enter into any harsh thinking about you just because others have.
That said I think you owe anyone you have hurt or belittled in here an apology as well, especially THEY who was actually scared of your potential to do harm with your mind alone. (At least one believed you could do so, amounting to a faith in your abilities.) I will close with this. I have never not loved you, I felt you were a brother who was at times abusive and out of control. But I loved you. I love you now. I still think you are in need of some help with your persecution complex. And I hope you will look into becoming a less threatened individual...and equally less threatening to others.
~PEACE~
Tikay
If I could I would give you ten positives for expressing these sentiments. As Carl Yung would say, you are a Queen in the making. Look out for "him" in your dreams, the man you feel so drawn towards and yet have not met before. He is your anima sancta.
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 12 2008, 07:45 PM)
Your position IS critical, whether you intend to be critical or not.
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
That statement indicates that you have not, as you've claimed, abandoned the act of judging. If you cannot judge others, you cannot judge yourself. (What standards would you judge yourself by, if not by the standards set by others?)
I think such would be an accurate (albiet grossly incomplete) description of an omnipotent being. But living hitler does not mean that God would forgive him, without punishment.
Absent punishment, why would anyone do the right thing? Very very few people do what is right for the sake of what is right. Ironically enough, most of them are NOT religious.
All in all, we would all prefer Robin to have been a rational, intelligent, honest man, but he made the hcoice not to be, and so he must either accept the consequences of such, or forever be in the wrong.
Can I call you BDW?
For me, there is a difference between judging and discernment. One is an active
delving into right and wrong, good and evil. The other is a passive realization, non active and more of a personal awareness.
That is not a realistically feasible point of view. If you refuse to judge others for any reason, then you refuse to
A: Improve yourself.
B: Show others how they can improve themselves.
C: Punish those who have done wrong.
and
D: Differentiate between good and evil.
Of those, D is the most important. If there is no judgement, then Hitler was as justified in what he did as Mother Theresa was.
That statement indicates that you have not, as you've claimed, abandoned the act of judging. If you cannot judge others, you cannot judge yourself. (What standards would you judge yourself by, if not by the standards set by others?)
I think such would be an accurate (albiet grossly incomplete) description of an omnipotent being. But living hitler does not mean that God would forgive him, without punishment.
Absent punishment, why would anyone do the right thing? Very very few people do what is right for the sake of what is right. Ironically enough, most of them are NOT religious.
All in all, we would all prefer Robin to have been a rational, intelligent, honest man, but he made the hcoice not to be, and so he must either accept the consequences of such, or forever be in the wrong.
Can I call you BDW?
For me, there is a difference between judging and discernment. One is an active
delving into right and wrong, good and evil. The other is a passive realization, non active and more of a personal awareness.
QUOTE (N O M+Mar 12 2008, 08:34 PM)
I agree. He has to be one of the most irritating posters I have ever seen. I'm just going to ignore him.
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
Thank you so much for your opinions NOM and a few of you others. NOM, don't accept cheap imitations. Be the best you can be. Only when trying to be that best ask yourself if you are harming any other aspect of life whilst practicing your free choice. If you discern that your action would harm some aspect of life, then you are not at your best.
Username - your negative feedback of "loontard" is very funny, thank you!
But I would like to know. Do religious gits like Marley get their lobotomy before or after they "find" god?
Thank you so much for your opinions NOM and a few of you others. NOM, don't accept cheap imitations. Be the best you can be. Only when trying to be that best ask yourself if you are harming any other aspect of life whilst practicing your free choice. If you discern that your action would harm some aspect of life, then you are not at your best.
Username - your negative feedback of "loontard" is very funny, thank you!
QUOTE (Trippy+Mar 12 2008, 03:45 PM)
However, if we make that assumption - that he's ill, then by his own standards that's still no excuse, because he's not making the effort to overcome his illness, moreover, by not deriding him for being abusive, we're facilitating his choice not to overcome his illness in our complacency.
So why should we hold Parsons to any lower standards then he held others to?
(As proof of this, simply look at some of the comments he left in my feedback, and in BDW's feedback).
Reading two negatives from Parsons to you is enough to remember that he has delusions of grandeur and obviously needs to seek out some form of therapeutic healing. I am not sure how I can go on being any sort of defender at this point but I will say I have made a renewed effort this day to be less offended by this person and be more willing to remove myself from any form of his abusive tactics, one does have to co-sign them by participating. I will continue to see him as a human cousin and someone who needs care, now weather I can provide that to him beyond a basic sisterly state I just don't know....And whether I can deal with him in the future, is debatable, thanks for the reminder of his oft obnoxious antagonistic attitude. I think it is best to show my love with avoidance.
At least I won't be antagonizing him right back!
I hope for his recovery and his ultimate growth as a human who learns the value of becoming more humane.
Now I hope that I have said my part in here because I won't let him be the vampire on my energy that he had become at some point. I will cast the past aside but for the remembrance that this is a person who I must attempt to avoid in the future, for I have not the capacity to understand him.
So why should we hold Parsons to any lower standards then he held others to?
(As proof of this, simply look at some of the comments he left in my feedback, and in BDW's feedback).
Reading two negatives from Parsons to you is enough to remember that he has delusions of grandeur and obviously needs to seek out some form of therapeutic healing. I am not sure how I can go on being any sort of defender at this point but I will say I have made a renewed effort this day to be less offended by this person and be more willing to remove myself from any form of his abusive tactics, one does have to co-sign them by participating. I will continue to see him as a human cousin and someone who needs care, now weather I can provide that to him beyond a basic sisterly state I just don't know....And whether I can deal with him in the future, is debatable, thanks for the reminder of his oft obnoxious antagonistic attitude. I think it is best to show my love with avoidance.
At least I won't be antagonizing him right back!
I hope for his recovery and his ultimate growth as a human who learns the value of becoming more humane.
Now I hope that I have said my part in here because I won't let him be the vampire on my energy that he had become at some point. I will cast the past aside but for the remembrance that this is a person who I must attempt to avoid in the future, for I have not the capacity to understand him.
QUOTE
Carl Yung
Oooops, Carl Jung , not Carl Yung the Austrian bear tamer.
QUOTE (SHEOL IS BACK+Mar 13 2008, 12:11 AM)
Oh goodness....
Now come on, don't hold yourself back, write something in bold font.
QUOTE (tikay+Mar 13 2008, 12:08 AM)
Reading two negatives from Parsons to you is enough to remember that he has delusions of grandeur and obviously needs to seek out some form of theraputic healing. I am not sure how I can go on being any sort of defender at this point but I will say I have made a renewed effort this day to be less offended by this person and be more willing to remove myself from any form of his abusive tactics, one does have to co-sign them by participating. I will continue to see him as a human cousin and someone who needs care. Whether I can deal with him in the future, is debatable, thanks for the reminder of his oft obnoxious antagonistic attitude.
I hope for his recovery and his ultimate growth as a human who learns the value of becoming more humane.
Now I hope that I have said my part in here because I won't let him be the vampire on my energy that he had become at some point. I will cast the past aside but for the rememberance that this is a person who I must attempt to avoid in the future, for I have not the capacity to understand him.
That is a very important point to make. We don't have to become involved and have our energy stolen by those that have emotional isues. Becoming less embroiled with it all is actually the space that these people are yearning for. They are scouring life looking for that one that will correct them, by simply not playing the reaction game to that which weighs them down inside. They, like all of us really, are looking for unconditional love to correct them (allow the space for inner correction to take place).
I hope for his recovery and his ultimate growth as a human who learns the value of becoming more humane.
Now I hope that I have said my part in here because I won't let him be the vampire on my energy that he had become at some point. I will cast the past aside but for the rememberance that this is a person who I must attempt to avoid in the future, for I have not the capacity to understand him.
That is a very important point to make. We don't have to become involved and have our energy stolen by those that have emotional isues. Becoming less embroiled with it all is actually the space that these people are yearning for. They are scouring life looking for that one that will correct them, by simply not playing the reaction game to that which weighs them down inside. They, like all of us really, are looking for unconditional love to correct them (allow the space for inner correction to take place).
Oh and about this fellow I am supposed to meet WHEN do you think it will come to pass?
(kidding)
WHEN do you think it will come to pass? (kidding)
I'm very wary of marley types - those who initially seem so damn nice.
Remember Mike Adams a.k.a Darth Sidious? ..... throughout my life, time after time, I've found these people manipulative, delusional, possessing as always, a dark hidden twisted agenda.
Could be wrong ? ..... however in the meantime:
User posted image: User posted image
Remember Mike Adams a.k.a Darth Sidious? ..... throughout my life, time after time, I've found these people manipulative, delusional, possessing as always, a dark hidden twisted agenda.
Could be wrong ? ..... however in the meantime:
User posted image: User posted image
According to good ol Carl Jung...we all have a shadow side, apparently mine is nicer than my other side.
Trolls only hang around if they are being fed. I think that the only reason RP stayed around this site was because people here were willing to engage in dialogue with him.
QUOTE (Username+Mar 13 2008, 01:58 PM)
I'm very wary of marley types - those who initially seem so damn nice.
It's because you are mistaking conceited for nice.
I find it ironic that this idiot is attacking the FM in defence of Brave.Sir.Robin, when it was the brave one who made himself particularly unpopular by starting off doing the same thing.
It's because you are mistaking conceited for nice.
QUOTE
Remember Mike Adams a.k.a Darth Sidious? ..... throughout my life, time after time, I've found these people manipulative, delusional, possessing as always, a dark hidden twisted agenda.
Squeeze was another.I find it ironic that this idiot is attacking the FM in defence of Brave.Sir.Robin, when it was the brave one who made himself particularly unpopular by starting off doing the same thing.
Maybe time for a bit of amateur psychology. No charge so no refunds available.
Hopefully most of us agree that Mr P. 'has problems':- this alone is sufficient to make him a target .. an easy target .. in fact the best type of target.
Gehn and NOM are clearly young :- this forum may be their first experience of the 'adult' world so there is no need to look for a 'motive' - the opportunity to attack an adult from behind the shield of anonymity is enough.
BDW has revealed that he grew up with Asperger's syndrome, despite an apparently normal life it appears he has not yet acquired 'empathy' and the normal barriers which are usually associated with adulthood.
It seems Trippy has been working with people suffering from Asperger's syndrome for five years (?) .. perhaps for him the abnormal has become normal so he neither expects nor exhibits some of the behaviours which would otherwise be 'normal' for someone of his age... he has effectively 'caught' Asperger's syndrome.
Just thoughts.
-C2.
MUCH more interesting .. would ANYONE like to work through the Cambridge First Year Applied maths lectures with me? ( http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/sjc1/teaching/ )
Hopefully most of us agree that Mr P. 'has problems':- this alone is sufficient to make him a target .. an easy target .. in fact the best type of target.
Gehn and NOM are clearly young :- this forum may be their first experience of the 'adult' world so there is no need to look for a 'motive' - the opportunity to attack an adult from behind the shield of anonymity is enough.
BDW has revealed that he grew up with Asperger's syndrome, despite an apparently normal life it appears he has not yet acquired 'empathy' and the normal barriers which are usually associated with adulthood.
It seems Trippy has been working with people suffering from Asperger's syndrome for five years (?) .. perhaps for him the abnormal has become normal so he neither expects nor exhibits some of the behaviours which would otherwise be 'normal' for someone of his age... he has effectively 'caught' Asperger's syndrome.
Just thoughts.
-C2.
MUCH more interesting .. would ANYONE like to work through the Cambridge First Year Applied maths lectures with me? ( http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/sjc1/teaching/ )
QUOTE
Gehn and NOM are clearly young
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Gehn and NOM are clearly young |
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
'Unconditional love is the only reality'
Now that DOES sound 'overrated'!
(Unless this is Derek's 'shadow', trying to prove itself 'right')g.
QUOTE (Confused2+Mar 13 2008, 06:39 AM)
Maybe time for a bit of amateur psychology. No charge so no refunds available.
Hopefully most of us agree that Mr P. 'has problems':- this alone is sufficient to make him a target .. an easy target .. in fact the best type of target.
Gehn and NOM are clearly young :- this forum may be their first experience of the 'adult' world so there is no need to look for a 'motive' - the opportunity to attack an adult from behind the shield of anonymity is enough.
BDW has revealed that he grew up with Asperger's syndrome, despite an apparently normal life it appears he has not yet acquired 'empathy' and the normal barriers which are usually associated with adulthood.
It seems Trippy has been working with people suffering from Asperger's syndrome for five years (?) .. perhaps for him the abnormal has become normal so he neither expects nor exhibits some of the behaviours which would otherwise be 'normal' for someone of his age... he has effectively 'caught' Asperger's syndrome.
Just thoughts.
-C2.
What, I don’t rate being the subject of an amateur psychoanalysis? I feel so neglected…
Hopefully most of us agree that Mr P. 'has problems':- this alone is sufficient to make him a target .. an easy target .. in fact the best type of target.
Gehn and NOM are clearly young :- this forum may be their first experience of the 'adult' world so there is no need to look for a 'motive' - the opportunity to attack an adult from behind the shield of anonymity is enough.
BDW has revealed that he grew up with Asperger's syndrome, despite an apparently normal life it appears he has not yet acquired 'empathy' and the normal barriers which are usually associated with adulthood.
It seems Trippy has been working with people suffering from Asperger's syndrome for five years (?) .. perhaps for him the abnormal has become normal so he neither expects nor exhibits some of the behaviours which would otherwise be 'normal' for someone of his age... he has effectively 'caught' Asperger's syndrome.
Just thoughts.
-C2.
What, I don’t rate being the subject of an amateur psychoanalysis? I feel so neglected…
QUOTE (Gorgeous+Mar 13 2008, 12:02 PM)
Surely you mean 'Jung'?
This 'marley' is just another 'god-freak' whose religion (read EGO) is going down the pan. He is defending his own 'beliefs', and nothing to do with Brave sir parsnip.
Looks more like another case of the 'dibedy's' to me!
Now that DOES sound 'overrated'!
(Unless this is Derek's 'shadow', trying to prove itself 'right')g.
Actually just a swift calling, dropping by to see what affect the ideal of unconditional love would have on ego, including mine. The treatment on some schizzophrenic seemed a good a time as any to interupt the flow.
I don't think there is any going down the pan. Religion has never had anything to do with it. Perhaps having a loner lifestyle helps. Either way the future is truly gorgeous.
What is a case of the "dibedys"?
Many problems stem from ‘isolation’. I find you can only ‘love’ a person with your heart if you know them, so no contact means no love. We don’t have any feeling for the unknown victim of a car crash for instance. You could consider that we are like a stick. If we are jostling among many we stand upright and are ‘balanced’, if we stand alone, it’s all too easy to fall over. I’ve met many so called ‘mentally unbalanced’ people. So many have the problem of just ‘living alone’. Acts of murder are over in a few seconds and are an extreme criminal act the like of which perhaps we could all make when driven to extremes. Is a man then to be judged for just that one act? Perhaps there were other very many acts over many years of great gentleness and goodness.
So many people today live on their own. How different it was in the old days with grandparents and aunts around to guide and discuss ‘every day’ from the viewpoint of really knowing you. Wasn’t it Oscar Wilde who said that ‘love can see the writing on the most distant star’. I have been unemployed, isolated, broke. These things lead to a lack of balance, tearful at the slightest thing going wrong, mouthing off at the drop of a hat. Now that I live in company, all is much better. When you live within a group and the group isolates you on the grounds that you are not worth knowing then all the problems begin. There has to be a let out for anger and frustration, and if we can’t find it within our personal lives – that is – someone to talk to, it is going to come out elsewhere, perhaps like here where there is the opportunity for dialogue. We all have something to say sometimes and we're all going to get it wrong at others.
Parents love their children, and those who truly do will try to bring up their children in a way that gets them accepted by society, ie. anti-social behaviour will be corrected. Loving their children they will know when discipline is necessary. So perhaps then the government, who does not understand the individual child, is irresponsible in trying to interfere in the child/parent relationship?
So many people today live on their own. How different it was in the old days with grandparents and aunts around to guide and discuss ‘every day’ from the viewpoint of really knowing you. Wasn’t it Oscar Wilde who said that ‘love can see the writing on the most distant star’. I have been unemployed, isolated, broke. These things lead to a lack of balance, tearful at the slightest thing going wrong, mouthing off at the drop of a hat. Now that I live in company, all is much better. When you live within a group and the group isolates you on the grounds that you are not worth knowing then all the problems begin. There has to be a let out for anger and frustration, and if we can’t find it within our personal lives – that is – someone to talk to, it is going to come out elsewhere, perhaps like here where there is the opportunity for dialogue. We all have something to say sometimes and we're all going to get it wrong at others.
Parents love their children, and those who truly do will try to bring up their children in a way that gets them accepted by society, ie. anti-social behaviour will be corrected. Loving their children they will know when discipline is necessary. So perhaps then the government, who does not understand the individual child, is irresponsible in trying to interfere in the child/parent relationship?
QUOTE (marley+Mar 13 2008, 02:45 PM)
What is a case of the "dibedys"?
It's a sarcastic reference to another member of the forum - it isn't a real disorder.
- Gehn
QUOTE (marley+Mar 12 2008, 06:55 PM)
Can I call you BDW?
Most do.
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
Most do.
QUOTE
For me, there is a difference between judging and discernment. One is an active
delving into right and wrong, good and evil. The other is a passive realization, non active and more of a personal awareness.
delving into right and wrong, good and evil. The other is a passive realization, non active and more of a personal awareness.
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 13 2008, 04:08 PM)
Most do.
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
Well not a lot to say there BDW, but thank you. I will leave you , and Physorg to your sureties.
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
Well not a lot to say there BDW, but thank you. I will leave you , and Physorg to your sureties.
QUOTE (sw81245+Mar 13 2008, 07:53 AM)
Many problems stem from ‘isolation’. I find you can only ‘love’ a person with your heart if you know them, so no contact means no love. We don’t have any feeling for the unknown victim of a car crash for instance. You could consider that we are like a stick. If we are jostling among many we stand upright and are ‘balanced’, if we stand alone, it’s all too easy to fall over. I’ve met many so called ‘mentally unbalanced’ people. So many have the problem of just ‘living alone’. Acts of murder are over in a few seconds and are an extreme criminal act the like of which perhaps we could all make when driven to extremes. Is a man then to be judged for just that one act? Perhaps there were other very many acts over many years of great gentleness and goodness.
So many people today live on their own. How different it was in the old days with grandparents and aunts around to guide and discuss ‘every day’ from the viewpoint of really knowing you. Wasn’t it Oscar Wilde who said that ‘love can see the writing on the most distant star’. I have been unemployed, isolated, broke. These things lead to a lack of balance, tearful at the slightest thing going wrong, mouthing off at the drop of a hat. Now that I live in company, all is much better. When you live within a group and the group isolates you on the grounds that you are not worth knowing then all the problems begin. There has to be a let out for anger and frustration, and if we can’t find it within our personal lives – that is – someone to talk to, it is going to come out elsewhere, perhaps like here where there is the opportunity for dialog. We all have something to say sometimes and we're all going to get it wrong at others.
Parents love their children, and those who truly do will try to bring up their children in a way that gets them accepted by society, ie. anti-social behaviour will be corrected. Loving their children they will know when discipline is necessary. So perhaps then the government, who does not understand the individual child, is irresponsible in trying to interfere in the child/parent relationship?
I joined this forum March 21 of 2006...I know that you can't be insinuating that I don't really care for these people that I talk to, because i have not seen some of them. I love some of them, more than others and love most of them that I have interactions with, based on those interactions. I believe that I am not lying when I said that I cared for, loved and decided to give my attentions to Robin...irritating as he could sometimes be to just about anyone who crossed his path.
When I chose to get to know him (read him) I invested my time and energy into him...which I find to be a somewhat valuable commodity. That is a form of love and respect, my attentions are not given to just everyone, even people who live in my home have to vie for my attentions with friendly and helpful behaviors, like keeping common areas cleaned up and not abusing the noise level. Otherwise I say hello and scram back into my little cave-like atmosphere, our cozy garage.
I live with six people whom my landlord chose...outside of my darling daughter, and they are not always people I would associate with if given a choice.
What I want to know is do you think my friendships in here are false? Because I rely much on this place for my kinship. I rarely spend enough time out in public to make other friends. This is my place to be friendly and make friends...a second home if you will. A sort of commune or community and I swear i care for everyone I associate with and I feel I love so many of (you) them...
I even considered putting a clause in a will for my family to write and let physorg know should I suddenly perish. How wrong it would seem to just one day be gone with no explanation to people I have been around for two years.
There is a new dynamic in the world I think, a new paradigm with computer relations. Love is not exclusively lent to relationships where you can actually touch the person. And affection not far from love, and friendliness not far from affection....and interest not far from friendliness, and reading someone is interest in them isn't it?
Anyway I just want to say that I won't have you saying that I don't love my pals in here. It may be a "different sort" of affectionate love, but love it is nonetheless!
They are my family, inasmuch as a person like me needs family, a person raised around groups of people...a person at home in groups of people, I feel that those I relate to in here are my surrogate family. I hope that doesn't seem sad to anyone, because it isn't to me. Except that if I lost my internet connection I would lose a whole family of people I admire, and hold in my heart. That is a little sad.
Anyway if we have been friends in here, I feel we are real friends folks. You are real, I am real and we have shared real moments...a computer cannot erase those times...it's been REAL. (And I would hug you all if I could!)
So many people today live on their own. How different it was in the old days with grandparents and aunts around to guide and discuss ‘every day’ from the viewpoint of really knowing you. Wasn’t it Oscar Wilde who said that ‘love can see the writing on the most distant star’. I have been unemployed, isolated, broke. These things lead to a lack of balance, tearful at the slightest thing going wrong, mouthing off at the drop of a hat. Now that I live in company, all is much better. When you live within a group and the group isolates you on the grounds that you are not worth knowing then all the problems begin. There has to be a let out for anger and frustration, and if we can’t find it within our personal lives – that is – someone to talk to, it is going to come out elsewhere, perhaps like here where there is the opportunity for dialog. We all have something to say sometimes and we're all going to get it wrong at others.
Parents love their children, and those who truly do will try to bring up their children in a way that gets them accepted by society, ie. anti-social behaviour will be corrected. Loving their children they will know when discipline is necessary. So perhaps then the government, who does not understand the individual child, is irresponsible in trying to interfere in the child/parent relationship?
I joined this forum March 21 of 2006...I know that you can't be insinuating that I don't really care for these people that I talk to, because i have not seen some of them. I love some of them, more than others and love most of them that I have interactions with, based on those interactions. I believe that I am not lying when I said that I cared for, loved and decided to give my attentions to Robin...irritating as he could sometimes be to just about anyone who crossed his path.
When I chose to get to know him (read him) I invested my time and energy into him...which I find to be a somewhat valuable commodity. That is a form of love and respect, my attentions are not given to just everyone, even people who live in my home have to vie for my attentions with friendly and helpful behaviors, like keeping common areas cleaned up and not abusing the noise level. Otherwise I say hello and scram back into my little cave-like atmosphere, our cozy garage.
I live with six people whom my landlord chose...outside of my darling daughter, and they are not always people I would associate with if given a choice.
What I want to know is do you think my friendships in here are false? Because I rely much on this place for my kinship. I rarely spend enough time out in public to make other friends. This is my place to be friendly and make friends...a second home if you will. A sort of commune or community and I swear i care for everyone I associate with and I feel I love so many of (you) them...
I even considered putting a clause in a will for my family to write and let physorg know should I suddenly perish. How wrong it would seem to just one day be gone with no explanation to people I have been around for two years.
There is a new dynamic in the world I think, a new paradigm with computer relations. Love is not exclusively lent to relationships where you can actually touch the person. And affection not far from love, and friendliness not far from affection....and interest not far from friendliness, and reading someone is interest in them isn't it?
Anyway I just want to say that I won't have you saying that I don't love my pals in here. It may be a "different sort" of affectionate love, but love it is nonetheless!
They are my family, inasmuch as a person like me needs family, a person raised around groups of people...a person at home in groups of people, I feel that those I relate to in here are my surrogate family. I hope that doesn't seem sad to anyone, because it isn't to me. Except that if I lost my internet connection I would lose a whole family of people I admire, and hold in my heart. That is a little sad.
Anyway if we have been friends in here, I feel we are real friends folks. You are real, I am real and we have shared real moments...a computer cannot erase those times...it's been REAL. (And I would hug you all if I could!)
QUOTE (BigDumbWeirdo+Mar 13 2008, 08:08 AM)
Most do.
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
I think I take umbrage with this viewpoint BDW....at least to the point that a person has no right to participate in a love experiment.
Now let us (briefly) examine the relationship of parents to children and of child to parent, for it is the best arena to practice unconditional love. We are not as children able to (easily) trade in our parents so, as children we are prone or we begin to love them unconditionally (no matter what they do) and to learn what forgiveness means, and how to partake of that emotion or dynamic.
As parents a similar dynamic occurs when our children are offensive or act badly...we love them unconditionally.
Taking that sort of love into the public arena is just a step toward treating the human race as close family members and many of us attempt to do this as a social experiment. I am not sure when it may have become vogue to do this but I will assume the 60's played a big part.
Now most of you know that I was raised in the 60's by hippies, and hillbillies too Samantha H...and that I embraced the lifestyle of these people for some years, and sometimes have a hard time living in this millennium....leaving the 60's behind.
This is because I believe in the things I learned then, that held value. And of all things I found valuable one was the ability to (for ones own sake as well) to forgive almost instantaneously any minor offense and in time even major offenses.
I have been abused by many in my lifetime and have needed to forgive much. People have problems, they are fallible, and make many (and sometimes horrible) mistakes "getting back to the garden". I think if I had not found that unconditional love was the best answer to those abuses I may not have pulled out of depressions and i may not be around to be talking to ya now. I have "gestured" at taking my own life, quite a few times in the past. I was terribly depressed.
The idea that unconditional love is a good method for living is not so strange and it includes blatant honesty actually. Many in California may attest to it's power and here are second and third generation self-actualized people, the power of self-realization has been acceptable here for some groups for a very long time...those people who were the first to experiment with such modes and memes, have come to bear offspring and they have been raised by people attaining (or attempting to be attuned to) self-actualization, and so they have sometimes become involved in the arena by osmosis. Now those striving to be more awake and attuned to honest living/loving and becoming authentic in their actions and being genuine citizens of a sort of mental state and lifestyle, that embraces this ideal of unconditional love are definitely out here...in the world and we have many books that attest to it's grandeur.
I guess it is a new age thing and many here would not know much about it while many others will. There is nothing wrong with someone who believes in this idea bringing it to us, and asking us to check into it. I for one appreciated it, as a reminder to be my best. To be forgiving and compassionate is not a crime...
Still we might attest that being honest is a part of loving someone unconditionally as well.... (respecting them enough to be truthful with them even if it isn't pretty) ABUSE of that person is not acceptable, being abusive to Robin because he was abusive is un-called for. Two wrongs do not make a right, in this case. It would be loving to explain our feelings to Robin...it would be loving to correct him, it would be loving to try to keep communications open but alas....not to begin to be abusive to him, using name-calling and tactics of complete derision.
In other words unconditional love would include discipline, just as a parent disciplines a child (and I might add children disipline their parental units) for their own good, but not include things we would not say to a child of our own. It would include ignoring if necessary to stop ourselves from abusing the abuser, but not engaging...and if we were to engage and it became an abusive situation where we were the instigator...to then feel the remorse that would be only human, and to ask for forgiveness and to try and do better.
It is basic ethics...having not much to do with etiquette which can be false and dishonest. It comes from a deeper place, a more honest place. How can you say that experimenting with honesty and love are wrong for anyone BDW, regardless of status or professional viability?
That is not realistic, either. That's nothing but a matter of semantics. Whenever you decide that one thing is worth more or less than another, you are judging. Whenever you decide that one option is more or less desirable than another, you are judging. Whether or not you act on your judgements is not a part of makign the judgement, but refusing to do so is in effect, signing your own death warrant. After all, since you judge it is better to give your wallet to the mugger than fight, or that it is better to eat when you are hungry than not to, but you refuse to act on your judgement, you will be ALWAYS making the wrong choice. You will try to grab the mugger's gun, and decide not to eat.
If, on the other hand, you act upon your judgements, you hand over your wallet then go home and report your credit cards stolen. You eat when you are hungry. Similary, you inform people when they are engaging in self-destructive and anti-social behavior. When they fail to listen, you warn them. When they fail to heed your warnign you punish them in whatever manner does not infringe upon their rights.
Such punishment is the VERY BASIS for society, and unless you have a PhD in sociology and psychology (which I am quite sure that you do not have) and you've written some nobel prize winning, landmark paper on a new form of social theory (which I am quite sure that you haven't) then you are not in a position to judge what has worked throughout human history, in the best and worst societies we have seen.
Notice how I used the word "judge" in that last sentence? I referred to your credentials (in the form of experience and education, but talent can also be added to that list). THAT is how you determine what and whom you have a right to judge. Lee Smolin writes books and papers which make claims about physics that I don't agree with, but do I go around proclaiming him to be an idiot of the highest order? No, because I understand that I have no right to judge his ability to do physics. The "secret" to a healthy psyche, as told to me by a very astute psychologist, is not to avoid judging others, but to know when to do so, and when to judge yourself.
Claims such as yours, that "unconditional love" is the secret to solving all of the world's social problems is itself a judgement. Your claims to have been "experimenting" with it involve you acting upon your judgement. Unfortunately, the one judgement in which you freely admit to participating in and acting upon is one which you have no right whatsoever to make.
I think I take umbrage with this viewpoint BDW....at least to the point that a person has no right to participate in a love experiment.
Now let us (briefly) examine the relationship of parents to children and of child to parent, for it is the best arena to practice unconditional love. We are not as children able to (easily) trade in our parents so, as children we are prone or we begin to love them unconditionally (no matter what they do) and to learn what forgiveness means, and how to partake of that emotion or dynamic.
As parents a similar dynamic occurs when our children are offensive or act badly...we love them unconditionally.
Taking that sort of love into the public arena is just a step toward treating the human race as close family members and many of us attempt to do this as a social experiment. I am not sure when it may have become vogue to do this but I will assume the 60's played a big part.
Now most of you know that I was raised in the 60's by hippies, and hillbillies too Samantha H...and that I embraced the lifestyle of these people for some years, and sometimes have a hard time living in this millennium....leaving the 60's behind.
This is because I believe in the things I learned then, that held value. And of all things I found valuable one was the ability to (for ones own sake as well) to forgive almost instantaneously any minor offense and in time even major offenses.
I have been abused by many in my lifetime and have needed to forgive much. People have problems, they are fallible, and make many (and sometimes horrible) mistakes "getting back to the garden". I think if I had not found that unconditional love was the best answer to those abuses I may not have pulled out of depressions and i may not be around to be talking to ya now. I have "gestured" at taking my own life, quite a few times in the past. I was terribly depressed.
The idea that unconditional love is a good method for living is not so strange and it includes blatant honesty actually. Many in California may attest to it's power and here are second and third generation self-actualized people, the power of self-realization has been acceptable here for some groups for a very long time...those people who were the first to experiment with such modes and memes, have come to bear offspring and they have been raised by people attaining (or attempting to be attuned to) self-actualization, and so they have sometimes become involved in the arena by osmosis. Now those striving to be more awake and attuned to honest living/loving and becoming authentic in their actions and being genuine citizens of a sort of mental state and lifestyle, that embraces this ideal of unconditional love are definitely out here...in the world and we have many books that attest to it's grandeur.
I guess it is a new age thing and many here would not know much about it while many others will. There is nothing wrong with someone who believes in this idea bringing it to us, and asking us to check into it. I for one appreciated it, as a reminder to be my best. To be forgiving and compassionate is not a crime...
Still we might attest that being honest is a part of loving someone unconditionally as well.... (respecting them enough to be truthful with them even if it isn't pretty) ABUSE of that person is not acceptable, being abusive to Robin because he was abusive is un-called for. Two wrongs do not make a right, in this case. It would be loving to explain our feelings to Robin...it would be loving to correct him, it would be loving to try to keep communications open but alas....not to begin to be abusive to him, using name-calling and tactics of complete derision.
In other words unconditional love would include discipline, just as a parent disciplines a child (and I might add children disipline their parental units) for their own good, but not include things we would not say to a child of our own. It would include ignoring if necessary to stop ourselves from abusing the abuser, but not engaging...and if we were to engage and it became an abusive situation where we were the instigator...to then feel the remorse that would be only human, and to ask for forgiveness and to try and do better.
It is basic ethics...having not much to do with etiquette which can be false and dishonest. It comes from a deeper place, a more honest place. How can you say that experimenting with honesty and love are wrong for anyone BDW, regardless of status or professional viability?
QUOTE (Confused2+Mar 13 2008, 11:39 PM)
It seems Trippy has been working with people suffering from Asperger's syndrome for five years (?) .. perhaps for him the abnormal has become normal so he neither expects nor exhibits some of the behaviours which would otherwise be 'normal' for someone of his age... he has effectively 'caught' Asperger's syndrome.
Wrong answer.
Moreover, anybody who actually bothers looking at my posting history will see that Myself, BDW, Gehn, and N O M, are all perfectly capable of carrying civil conversations.
Your assertions have no grounding in reality.
Wrong answer.
Moreover, anybody who actually bothers looking at my posting history will see that Myself, BDW, Gehn, and N O M, are all perfectly capable of carrying civil conversations.
Your assertions have no grounding in reality.
QUOTE (GeneSplicer+Mar 14 2008, 02:04 AM)
What, I don’t rate being the subject of an amateur psychoanalysis? I feel so neglected…
There sure is enough people around willing to offer them.
There sure is enough people around willing to offer them.
QUOTE (Trippy+)
anybody who actually bothers looking at my posting history will see that Myself, BDW, Gehn, and N O M, are all perfectly capable of carrying civil conversations.
Hey, don't forget me!
Agreed.
Hey, don't forget me!
QUOTE
Your assertions have no grounding in reality.
Agreed.
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