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Jerry Duke
http://www.physorg.com/news6647.html

... fundamental design principles of natural armor systems like shells ...

... nature is indeed an expert nanoengineer ...

"The complexity we have observed in nacre at the nanoscale is quite amazing and seems likely to be a critical determinant of the toughness of the material," said Ortiz
... design at multiple-length scales ... Understanding how the material is designed and functions at the smallest-length scales will be critical to learning how to create tough biomimetic synthetic composites."

...Nature uses nanoscale structural design principles ... human engineers have yet to achieve the same skill ...
adoucette
QUOTE (Jerry Duke+Sep 22 2005, 05:08 PM)
...Nature uses nanoscale structural design principles ... human engineers have yet to achieve the same skill ...

So what?

We used to build things like the Pyramids an Stonehenge.

Cells operate at the nano level and have since the earliest times.

To them it is the natural realm based upon their relative size as 2x4s are to us based upon our size.

Arthur
solidspin
jee -

That's funny. The nanoparticles I just made and then changed their atomic structure by loading them w/ 30ul of a super-Lewis acid are giving me great spectra and making my PhD adviser very happy.

Perhaps I'm sooooooooperhuman?

d'oh, I think not. I'm just a regular person, but I did save a TON of money by switching to Geico!

Arthur - ignore the idiotic ramblings of Jerry "the simpleton" Duke - he's a classic biblebanger in the worst way, and obviously has no idea what he's talking about. I've made 2 different types of monodisperse nanoparticles and have completed the first phase of a third.

Also, we can grow chiral nanoparticles which spontaneously assemble, too.

-ss
adoucette
QUOTE (Jerry Duke+Sep 23 2005, 07:16 PM)
Close your eyes and try building a shell from nanoscale on up using only blind chance and natural selection.


Sure,

You see I'm a flat worm and I like to scrape my food off of the many coelenerates that proliferate the oceans where I live. But there is one problem, being I'm a flatworm I have no anus and so I can only eat but so much and worse what I eat has bunches of calcium I can't use. I get rid of the calcium by secreting it through my skin, but it leaves a slimy trail. Talk about YUCK.

But, my billionth grandkid was born weird, instead of secreting unneeded calcium from all sides like all the rest of us, all his calcium secretion glands are on just one side.

We make fun of him and call him Hump 'cause that excess calcium builds up faster than it wears off the rest of us leaving him with a white mass on his backside.

Of course, when one of them new-fangled round-worms (I swear if God wanted us to be round he would have made us round) tried to eat Hump it was fortunate that he had that mess on his back cause the round-worm could find no purchase.

To bad about those other thousand cousins of mine, and damn them round-worms anyway.

Well, it turns out that Hump's fending off the dreaded round-worm was the talk of the reef and he certainly got the attention of some of those cute young flatworms that like to hang out around the Stony Coral, cause wouldn't you know it, come the next full moon there were a bunch of little Humps damn near everywhere you looked.

I swear, I just don't know what this new generation is evolving into.

Arthur.
philip347
Humans by and large do not, understand the full implications of advanced self intelligence, among robots and androids, or other sentient systems.

They do not.

This is, they are neither experienced enough, or are not offworld capable, to build up this knowledge base, via experience of encounters with other worlds.

After a while, away from many, some self intelligence defense systems, may adopt a violence self extinguishing program.This said, to where the source of both their violence, and confusion among conflict, might be sourced, to the defense soal clashes, between testosterone and estrogen social sets.

At this point in time, then the entire weapons system, might self reiterate and then adopt a more native or nature oriented related social prose, to the surroundings, about?
adoucette
QUOTE (Jerry Duke+Sep 23 2005, 09:53 PM)

Arthur's story sounds like a myth to me. Let me know if you find a flat worm with a calcium hump that breeds true. Marine Flat Worms



Of course its myth.

Have you NO sense of humor?

The actual evolution of species that evolved billions of years ago is no easy thing to trace as the following description of Gastropod evolution will attest:

Unambiguous Gastropods first appear in the second half of the late Cambrian (Dolgellian Age), probably evolving from bellerophontiform "tergyma" ("monoplacophora") like Cyrtolites. Earlier spiral shells attributed to the class, and dating to the early and middle Cambrian, are now considered to be non-molluscan (e.g. Aldanella) or non-gastropod (either Helcionellid, tergmyan, or Paragastropod) mollusk.

Like the Cephalopods that also appeared at this time, Gastropods radiated very quickly, but unlike the Cephalopods made it through the end Cambrian mass extinction event with few casualties. These very early forms can in a variety of shell types, including bellerophontiform, discoidal (planispiral), low-spired anistrophical (conventional helically coiled spiral) and hyperstrophic ("upside down" spiral - Macluritina) coiled forms, loosely coiled, and high spired types.

Working out the evolutionary relationships of creatures long-gone is not easy. All these very early forms used to be included under the now redundant taxon "Archaeogastropoda". Also, Dr Wagner's cladistic analysis [Wagner 1999] has shown that many forms previously considered Vetigastropod (Pleurotomarid) are actually members of either the Euomphalida (probably Eogastropoda) or the Murchisoniida (probably Orthogastropoda). The bellerophontiform gastropods he considers to be bi-phyletic, with one group perhaps ancestral to, and another an off-shoot of, a very early paraphyletic assemblage called the Sinuopeidae (latest Cambrian to middle of the Early Ordovician). Of course, it is also possible that the Sinuopeids evolved from torted bellerophontiforms, which in turn developed from untorted bellerophontiforms.

However, while looking for an example of evolution for you I did find this:

Snails Caught in Act of Evolution
By William J. Cromie

Gazette Staff

An elegant and direct example of evolution in action has been found by Harvard paleontologist Stephen Jay Gould while exploring a beach in the Bahamas.

Walking along the south shore of Great Inagua Island, the Agassiz Professor of Zoology noticed a telltale change in the shells of land snails scattered on a mud flat. He saw large, finger-shaped

shells of Cerion excelsior, an extinct snail once widespread in the Bahamas. Nearby were smaller, rounder, vertically striped shells with prominent whorls, belonging to a species called Cerion rubicundum, a well-known resident of the island.

"Scattered between them were thousands of highly variable shells spanning the full range of form from pure C. excelsior through intermediates of all degrees to C. rubicundum," Gould recalled. "It was difficult to escape the idea that the former had evolved into the later."

The history of life on Earth is written in shells, bones, footprints, and imprints found in mountains, canyons, and at the bottom of the seas. Over millions of years, movements of air, water, and continents destroy these silent signs, creating gaps in the natural record, or the fossils are scattered and compressed in different layers of sedimentary rocks. Gould, who is also curator of invertebrate paleontology at the Museum of Comparative Zoology, was looking down at a complete story of one species evolving into another in less than 20,000 years.

See:

http://www.news.harvard.edu/gazette/1997/0...sCaughtinA.html

for the complete text.

Arthur
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