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TracerTong
Why is energy=mc squared an equation? What about enthalpy? Free Energy? (not enthropy)
[To theists-- Is it because Jesus is constant, in Him we live, move, and have our being?]
AlexG
QUOTE (TracerTong+Aug 24 2009, 05:44 PM)
Why is energy=mc squared an equation?

Because it conforms to this definition:

an expression or a proposition, often algebraic, asserting the equality of two quantities.

If what you're asking where did the equation e=mc^2 come from, the derivation can be found here (among numerous other places)

http://www.adamauton.com/warp/emc2.html
buttershug
The important question is; Could it have been different?
TracerTong
QUOTE (buttershug+Aug 24 2009, 11:55 PM)
The important question is; Could it have been different?

Can you explain, I'm not good with math? Is Absolute 0 degrees possible in the natural physical or does this model not really exist? I'll try to look through my physics book, there's a classical version. Maybe I can understand the theory without the math. What it means.
buttershug
If E could not have been anything other than equal to mc^2 then God had not real part in it.
AlexG
QUOTE
Is Absolute 0 degrees possible in the natural physical or does this model not really exist?


No, it is not possible. Absolute 0 would mean no motion on the subatomic scale, and quantum mechanics does not allow that to happen.
TracerTong
QUOTE (buttershug+Aug 25 2009, 12:41 AM)
If E could not have been anything other than equal to mc^2 then God had not real part in it.
Explain logic please. Fallacy on Authority
http://www.logicalfallacies.info/
(Confused)
buttershug
QUOTE (TracerTong+Aug 25 2009, 03:09 PM)
Explain logic please. Fallacy on Authority
http://www.logicalfallacies.info/
(Confused)

"If God had not choice then God had no choice." is a tautology.
The question is "Did God have a choice?".

For God to have a choice there must be an alternative to E=mc^2.
If there is no alternative to E=mc^2 then God had no choice.


It is not an appeal to authority, I"m not saying God said something or other. I"m not even saying God exists. I"m saying that if there is no alternative then God had no choice.
TracerTong
QUOTE (buttershug+Aug 25 2009, 04:17 PM)
"If God had not choice then God had no choice." is a tautology.
The question is "Did God have a choice?".

Interesting! GG ok,
I came up with a diagram/model to try to explain. I'm not good with math.
http://fearlessfool.wordpress.com/2009/08/...rceptual-model/

The problem is your talking as if God(truth) really existed -- an absolute truth/unchanging
Hope your head doesn't hurt from the model - you see space, energy, matter (time not real to us) (sometimes natural atheists see spirits)
We see God as being able to do anything - A metaphor is "think outside the box" (with time being nonphysical) Another atheist asked a similar question - and my answer is "He chose us"

Eph 1:4-10 KJV
According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;
8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;
9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times he might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in him:

You can choose Him.
TracerTong
QUOTE (TracerTong+Aug 24 2009, 10:44 PM)
Why is energy=mc squared an equation?  What about enthalpy?  Free Energy?  (not enthropy) 
[To theists-- Is it because Jesus is constant, in Him we live, move, and have our being?]

To answer my own question, I found out (again) rediscovered that there is kinetic and potential energy. Moderator you can lock this thread.
Drive The Nail
QUOTE (TracerTong+Aug 24 2009, 10:44 PM)
Why is energy=mc squared an equation? What about enthalpy? Free Energy? (not enthropy)
[To theists-- Is it because Jesus is constant, in Him we live, move, and have our being?]

The whole E=mc^2 equation was the proof used to back the theory that energy and mass in motion were the same thing.
Regarding Enthalpy and free energy, those where the main 2 reasons why this theory may have been created. It solves the reason why we could lose mass through emissions of radiation in a reaction - they had to relate energy to mass.
Nothing could explain things like radiant energy (example, in the form of gamma, or visible light) and certainly nothing could hope to explain heat.
You can't have a quantity of heat and put it somewhere and you can't have a bucket full of light itself. So this equation was an attempt to explain that mass itself is in constant motion, often erratic, and mass is therefore 'Energy'. The general belief is sub atomic particles are made of energy ... electrons aren't made of electron material, they consist of packets of energy because at that size they are no longer capable of emitting light or contributing light energy, they cannot be physically seen. The millions of definitions of E=mc^2 will surely explain this stuff anyway.
Jesus, had very little to do with any of this - Though Jesus was most likely modeled from our prime example of the E=mc^2 equation .... our Sun.
E=mc^2 is only 1 explanation, sure there could be other explanations but this one more or less relies on the relationship of mass to energy, to light .... if those aren't related.... E=mc^2 will be useless and God will still have nothing to do with any of it.
AlphaNumeric
http://www.btinternet.com/~j.doyle/SR/Emc2/Derive.htm

Nothing to do with Jesus, God or whatever. It's the simple logical result of the two postulates of special relativity. Einstein said "If I assume that all inertial frames are equally valid and they all see light move at c, what does that imply?" and one answer to that question is E=mc^2.

Anyone brining in "Is it because Jesus is constant" is so desperate to try to give their faith some kind of scientific standing or interpretation that they really want to take a good long look at themselves. Faith is fine. But don't delude yourself so utterly that you have to twist "Jesus is constant, in Him we live, move, and have our being" into "E=mc^2". It's pathetic, really it is. You should accept that the nature of faith is that you don't have evidence, you don't have any kind of scientific validity, you have unsupported beliefs. Trying to convince yourself and others that science has some kind of backing to your claims suggests to me that you're not as confident in your beliefs as you would like others to believe.
TracerTong
QUOTE (AlphaNumeric+Sep 3 2009, 07:07 AM)
http://www.btinternet.com/~j.doyle/SR/Emc2/Derive.htm

Nothing to do with Jesus, God or whatever. It's the simple logical result of the two postulates of special relativity. Einstein said "If I assume that all inertial frames are equally valid and they all see light move at c, what does that imply?" and one answer to that question is E=mc^2.

For a joke (mocking) I put Evolution=mc^2? Because evolution requires energy and everything(functions have dependancies) It appears that everything is part of a function or a function. I don't know who got Jesus=mc^2? If mass and energy start at 0 its hard to go to just a single molecule for molecules to man evo. Maybe I'm using the wrong formula?
flyingbuttressman
QUOTE (TracerTong+Sep 3 2009, 12:57 PM)
For a joke (mocking) I put Evolution=mc^2? Because evolution requires energy and everything(functions have dependancies) It appears that everything is part of a function or a function. I don't know who got Jesus=mc^2? If mass and energy start at 0 its hard to go to just a single molecule for molecules to man evo. Maybe I'm using the wrong formula?

W.T.F. is wrong with you?
TracerTong
QUOTE (flyingbuttressman+Sep 3 2009, 05:03 PM)
W.T.F. is wrong with you?

I need to study energy more. Feel free to explain, I'm getting confused. Dead things have molecules in motion, a chair does. Feel free to recommend sites on energy.
buttershug
Energy is the ability to do work.
Work is force times distance.


E=MC^2 is several years of study ahead of where you are.

And you won't learn unless you can learn with an open mind. And accept what you find.

And hopefully somewhere along the line you understand why it was such a big event when someone accidently made artificial urea.
It was almost as important as the Theory of Evolution.
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