G'day from the land of ozzzzzzz
You may find this topic interesting
http://arxiv.org/abs/astro-ph/9212005The Escape of Gravitational Radiation from the Field of Massive Bodies
Authors: Richard H. Price, Jorge Pullin, Prasun Kundu
(Submitted on 23 Dec 1992)
QUOTE
Abstract: We consider a compact source of gravitational waves of frequency $\omega$, in or near a massive spherically symmetric distribution of matter or a black hole. Recent calculations have led to apparently contradictory results for the influence of the massive body on the propagation of the waves. We show here that the results are in fact consistent and in agreement with the ``standard'' viewpoint in which the high frequency compact source produces the radiation as if in a flat background, and the background curvature affects the propagation of these waves.
Hawking cracks black hole paradox
14/07/2004 19:00
http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn6151Quote:
After nearly 30 years of arguing that a black hole destroys everything that falls into it, Stephen Hawking is saying he was wrong. It seems that black holes may after all allow information within them to escape. Hawking will present his latest finding at a conference in Ireland next week.
Hawking concedes black hole bet
21/07/2004 19:26
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...-hole-bet.htmlBlack holes turned 'inside out'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3913145.stmQuote:
Stephen Hawking has put forward a new theory that changes the way scientists view black holes, saying he was wrong about them in the past.
Stephen Hawking, Black
Holes And Alex Collier
http://www.rense.com/general54/zlecx.htmQUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Abstract: We consider a compact source of gravitational waves of frequency $\omega$, in or near a massive spherically symmetric distribution of matter or a black hole. Recent calculations have led to apparently contradictory results for the influence of the massive body on the propagation of the waves. We show here that the results are in fact consistent and in agreement with the ``standard'' viewpoint in which the high frequency compact source produces the radiation as if in a flat background, and the background curvature affects the propagation of these waves. |
Hawking cracks black hole paradox
14/07/2004 19:00
http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn6151Quote:
After nearly 30 years of arguing that a black hole destroys everything that falls into it, Stephen Hawking is saying he was wrong. It seems that black holes may after all allow information within them to escape. Hawking will present his latest finding at a conference in Ireland next week.
Hawking concedes black hole bet
21/07/2004 19:26
http://www.newscientist.com/article/...-hole-bet.htmlBlack holes turned 'inside out'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/3913145.stmQuote:
Stephen Hawking has put forward a new theory that changes the way scientists view black holes, saying he was wrong about them in the past.
Stephen Hawking, Black
Holes And Alex Collier
http://www.rense.com/general54/zlecx.htmIn his lecture he says that the Andromedans told him that: "Everything in our universe, including us, came from a black hole."
Hawking Loses Bet; Changes Mind on Black Holes
http://www.space.com/news/hawking_bet_040716.htmlQUOTE
"I've been thinking about this problem for the last 30 years, and I think I now have the answer to it," Hawking told the British Broadcasting Corp.'s "Newsnight" program.
"A black hole only appears to form but later opens up and releases information about what fell inside. So we can be sure of the past and predict the future."
RobDegraves
5th June 2009 - 03:12 AM
I certainly hope you intended that as a joke.
These guys are nuts.
Saying that Stephen Hawkings proves that Alex Collier is right is like saying that because monkeys go "OOk OOk" that proves that we evolved from reptiles.
Oh.. wait..
You guys are saying that.. or at least something equally as absurd.
Harry Costas
5th June 2009 - 04:10 AM
G'day Rob
Whats your point?
It's not what we say but! What Hawking says.
RobDegraves
5th June 2009 - 05:26 AM
Hmmm... no.. it's not what Hawking says.. it's the fact that you misinterpret what he says to try to and use it as evidence for something obviously retarded.
Stephen Hawking is saying that the information paradox can be solved. This does have implications for physics but has nothing to do with what you are trying to talk about.
Saying that Hawking's solution proves that aliens came out of a Black Hole is like saying you can put a cow in a blender and pull out a kitten.
To say that Collier is either a con or insane is easily a truism
Which one are you?
Harry Costas
5th June 2009 - 05:44 AM
G'day Rob
In other words you think that nothing can escape a black hole.
THan please define a black hole and its properties.
RobDegraves
5th June 2009 - 05:58 AM
Hmmm...
First of all... don't say "in other words" if you don't understand what I said.
Secondly, this has nothing to do with whether I think energy can escape a Black Hole. You still can't pull out aliens from the fifth dimension out of what Hawking has to say.
Listen... if you are really stupid enough to believe this con job...
Either you need psychological help yourself... or you aren't smart enough to argue with in the first place. Seriously... I try to be polite but this is ridiculous stuff. Aliens from Andromeda? Lizard people that are corrupting us? The Tooth Fairy is at least a reasonable myth.
Harry Costas
5th June 2009 - 08:06 AM
G'day Rob
What if?
Is it worth knowing the information?
Please do not think for one sec, that what I'm saying comes from a rice bubble pack.
To understand compact matter is the key to it all.
AlphaNumeric
5th June 2009 - 09:31 AM
Grumpy
5th June 2009 - 01:05 PM
Harry Costas
QUOTE
Stephen Hawking, Black
Holes And Alex Collier
http://www.rense.com/general54/zlecx.htm You are such a nimrod, you believe everything you read without the filter of any reasoning ability.
All Hawking was talking about was information about what had been eaten in the past by a BH is preserved. He is not saying any MATTER can leave an event horizon, just INFORMATION about that matter.
Just what stupid garbage are you going to post next time???
Grumpy
philip347
5th June 2009 - 04:43 PM
These answers are all wrong, as Hawking Radation, is realted in part to materials taken in by any black hole.
RobDegraves
5th June 2009 - 04:48 PM
Would you care to explain Phillip?
rpenner
5th June 2009 - 05:38 PM
QUOTE (Grumpy+Jun 4 2009, 01:37 PM)
the area of the event horizon varies as the cube of the radius
This is what I spotted, Grumpy. I disagree.
philip347
5th June 2009 - 05:44 PM
The process of the formation of black holes are leftover aspects of usually stars that have undergone the process of collapse.
This mathematically give the dimension of one, to the baseline equation, as the density of the black hole, is that it is such that only a next to next leftover of atomic structures is present.
So this is indefinite mass, over normal space-time as a solid state factor.
The core density is of little matter at this point, however what is of important, are the magnetic fields, however they may express themselves, which is relational to time space.
So therefore, what one is looking for, are magnetic lines of representation as enacted from the core density itself.
The computer modeling is available for this stement to act as a working movement drawing in the CAD CAM visual drawing arena.
>You now have two probable in function set theories.
A. Would be the locus of the primary virgin black hole, that is probably by itself, however does or might not take in any matter, other than stellar dust.
The yield off of Hawking Radiation from example A. would be, what is the slighter expression of matter which is taken into the magnetic envelope of a black hole, then taken apart? Two as a subset function, where is this expression of matter exhausted?
The answer as in probability as most black hole center densities are round, would be an analiation expression of Hawking Radiation, at the near poles.
This fact was observed a while back by the Hawking investigative group, as a radiation expression of glow, near the relative poles north and south of a black hole.
TWO,B The second example would not be a non virgin black hole, that would be placed in an area of time space to where an average amount of leftover matter is observed being taken into the magnetic fields, of a black hole.
As said in published theory, these magnetic force lines generated by the singularity density are so intense, that these lines of force rip down the basic structure of the atoms of most matter.
So since time space is a multi fielded reality, with many differing dimensions to it, the take in matter that is taken into the event horizon or other parts of the take in spacts of the black hole, must be expressed as with reference to the universal law of energy conservation.
This factor would mean, on the non virgin black hole, that a ring as expressed near the north and south poles of most black holes, would express the dimensionalities of the taken in and ripped apart matter.
So therefore what Hawking Radiation is, is it seems a similar to microwavic generational forces, as expressed as to display, by more than dualist representation of changed taken in by black hole matter.
Sources, mechanics of the Hawking primary investigative group, as published by physicist writer, Marcia Bartsuiack
philip347
5th June 2009 - 05:56 PM
Notes on post: Nobody is absolutely sure that all black hole densities are round?
The magnetic lines of expression around a black hole, are expressed as force lines held in a field.
There must be a tidal rip, which catches most matter within that filed, then tears at this matter.
A near virgin black holes is possible for a mathematical expression of x or said value amount of time.
Harry Costas
6th June 2009 - 04:38 AM
G'day from the land of ozzz
Phillip I think you are on track.
To understand the properties of black holes one may need to read up on Nuclear transition phases.
These are general research via arXiv, you can also to a search via NASA\ADS
Nuclear transition phase cosmology
http://arxiv.org/find/all/1/all:+AND+cosmo...e/0/1/0/all/0/1Nuclear transition phase
http://arxiv.org/find/all/1/all:+AND+trans...e/0/1/0/all/0/1By understanding transition phase we can understand the properties of what makes up the so called black holes.
Vector fields can prevent EMR from escaping.
But!
To have a spherical BH it is not possible, due to the quantum that makes up the BH.
Electromagnetic waves would create a vortex that is able to form a jet formation that gravity radiation can excape and carry with it quantum particles close to the speed of light. We notice these properties in jets from Jets large and small. Their stability is more comon from large active galactic nuclei from ultra large compact matter that some call black holes.
RobDegraves
6th June 2009 - 06:30 AM
Wow...
That was an unusually long series of babbling nonsense.
Seriously... has either of you ever considered actually taking a few courses on this stuff... or is it easier to make it up as you go?
Harry Costas
6th June 2009 - 07:37 AM
G'day Rob
Why not give us you scientific opinion on the matter rather than an emotional hangup.
Grumpy
6th June 2009 - 01:12 PM
rpenner
Sphere Surface Area = 4 • Pi • r² = Pi • d²
You are right, my bad.
Harry Costas
QUOTE
Electromagnetic waves would create a vortex that is able to form a jet formation that gravity radiation can excape and carry with it quantum particles close to the speed of light. We notice these properties in jets from Jets large and small. Their stability is more comon from large active galactic nuclei from ultra large compact matter that some call black holes.
Nothing can escape THE EVENT HORIZON. It does not matter one whit what is happening within the EH to the matter making up the BH. Jets are a phenomina of the ACCRETION DISK and it's magnetic field, powered by the BH's gravity. They are ELECTROMAGNETIC in nature, not gravity "radiation".
Grumpy
Harry Costas
7th June 2009 - 01:19 AM
G'day from the land of ozzzzzzz
There is this notion that some scientists think that nothing can escape a so called black hole.
They have taken this to heart without knowing the properties of compact matter.
This notion has trapped some scientists in not researching further the actual formation of super jet formation that is able to remain stable for millions of years.
We live now in the modern ERA.
http://arxiv.org/abs/0902.1569Are black holes in alternative theories serious astrophysical candidates? The case for Einstein-Dilaton-Gauss-Bonnet black holes
Authors: Paolo Pani, Vitor Cardoso
(Submitted on 10 Feb 2009 (v1), last revised 21 Apr 2009 (this version, v3))
QUOTE
Abstract: It is generally accepted that Einstein's theory will get some as yet unknown corrections, possibly large in the strong field regime. An ideal place to look for these modifications is around the vicinities of compact objects such as black holes. Our case study here are Dilatonic Black Holes, which arise in the framework of Gauss-Bonnet couplings and one-loop corrected four-dimensional effective theory of heterotic superstrings at low energies. These are interesting objects as a prototype for alternative, yet well-behaved gravity theories: they evade the "no-hair" theorem of General Relativity but were proved to be stable against radial perturbations. We investigate the viability of these black holes as astrophysical objects and try to provide some means to distinguish them from black holes in General Relativity. We start by extending previous works and establishing the stability of these black holes against axial perturbations. We then look for solutions of the field equations describing slowly rotating black holes and study geodesic motion around this geometry. Depending on the values of mass, dilaton charge and angular momentum of the solution, one can have measurable differences in the ISCO location and orbital frequency, relatively to black holes in General Relativity. Such differences may be useful in future experiments, to discriminate between alternative theories of gravity.
and
http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.3850Black holes and black hole thermodynamics without event horizons
Authors: Alex B. Nielsen
(Submitted on 23 Sep 2008)
QUOTE (->
| QUOTE |
| Abstract: It is generally accepted that Einstein's theory will get some as yet unknown corrections, possibly large in the strong field regime. An ideal place to look for these modifications is around the vicinities of compact objects such as black holes. Our case study here are Dilatonic Black Holes, which arise in the framework of Gauss-Bonnet couplings and one-loop corrected four-dimensional effective theory of heterotic superstrings at low energies. These are interesting objects as a prototype for alternative, yet well-behaved gravity theories: they evade the "no-hair" theorem of General Relativity but were proved to be stable against radial perturbations. We investigate the viability of these black holes as astrophysical objects and try to provide some means to distinguish them from black holes in General Relativity. We start by extending previous works and establishing the stability of these black holes against axial perturbations. We then look for solutions of the field equations describing slowly rotating black holes and study geodesic motion around this geometry. Depending on the values of mass, dilaton charge and angular momentum of the solution, one can have measurable differences in the ISCO location and orbital frequency, relatively to black holes in General Relativity. Such differences may be useful in future experiments, to discriminate between alternative theories of gravity. |
and
http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.3850Black holes and black hole thermodynamics without event horizons
Authors: Alex B. Nielsen
(Submitted on 23 Sep 2008)
Abstract: We investigate whether black holes can be defined without using event horizons. In particular we focus on the thermodynamic properties of event horizons and the alternative, locally defined horizons. We discuss the assumptions and limitations of the proofs of the zeroth, first and second laws of black hole mechanics for both event horizons and trapping horizons. This leads to the possibility that black holes may be more usefully defined in terms of trapping horizons. We also show how Hawking radiation can also be seen to arise from trapping horizons and discuss which horizon area should be associated with the gravitational entropy.
RobDegraves
7th June 2009 - 03:45 AM
QUOTE
This notion has trapped some scientists in not researching further the actual formation of super jet formation that is able to remain stable for millions of years.
Do you have any research on these jets other than UFO abductees?
Just curious.
Harry Costas
8th June 2009 - 11:56 PM
G'day from the land of ozzzzzzzz
Hello Rob
The research on jets their formation and properties is general information and can be found just by Google, or arXiv or NASA/ADS.
Grumpy
9th June 2009 - 01:43 AM
Harry Costas
Event Horizon=radius from a BH where escape velocity exceeds lightspeed.
Nothing with mass can exceed light speed.
Therefore nothing with mass can escape a BH.
It's really pretty simple.
Grumpy
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