QUOTE (soundhertz+May 20 2012, 02:53 AM)
The fact that corporations have been using dowsing and feng shui for years because of statistically positive outcomes speaks for itself.
Because successful individuals and groups incorporate superstitious beliefs and behaviors into their professional activity, that legitimizes the superstition? The acceptance of that form of statistical interpretation is the stuff of marketing executiveís wet dreams. Captains of industry smoke Marlboros, heads of state drink Coca Cola, the most interesting man in the world drinks Dos Equis. Statistics show that success can be had using these products, therefore they are an essential ingredient for success.
20th May 2012 - 03:08 PM
Why would a corporation use dowsing?
20th May 2012 - 04:45 PM
Because they find water and oil deep under ground. Statistically, it has a positive result. Corporations like to make money, and they don't care about the means to get it, good or bad. They care about the results. It's curious that so many people don't know dowsing is still fairly wisely employed. I've never tried it myself; have no interest. But the info is there. Police even use psychics. I won't go so far as to put that in the same frame, but dowsing, hypnosis, and placebo effect seem related.
afa successful psychic use, perhaps Derek could provide any interesting testimonial to it; he's had a long career and perhaps there was a time or two that it was employed - successfully or unsuccessfully.
21st May 2012 - 01:43 AM
O.K. my well driller says it is bogus . We check the wells in the area and determine by that about were the aquifer is . The depth . If you good average of the surrounding area you can tell much better than dowsing . I had one customer who believed in dowsing and they hired an expert dowser . More of a hope for better results . So he said right there is water at x amount depth . You can't move off of that mark by more than 5 feet any direction . Well the well driller moved about 10 ft for ease of his equipment . So the well driller did hit about what the dowser said and it was consistent with the surrounding wells. The thing is the dowser can pull well logs with the best of them . Now the well driller had practical experience by drilling a good percentage of the surrounding wells. So he knew at what the depth water was . The ten ft made no difference.
My step father was a dowser . He did a good job at making it look real . Mainly he located electrical , phone and gas lines . I think that was more builder experience based on typical direction of services and what he would do if he was planning services . He held 2 bent copper wires about the thickness of coat hangers and when he would come to the ditch he would twang em out to the side. Course you usually have city records to help out with that and if again you know the typical of building practices from digging up old lines in the area . If your real good like Me then you can see old depressions of ditches . Disturbed soils and such . Or like septic lines you can see greener patches of grass . It can be hit and miss still but ditch depressions go a long ways in locating things like services .
Now water features it is hard to tell unless you have geological mapping of soil profiles. Then Geo-engineers can differentiate by layering . I would say if it is critical Geo-engineers are your best bang for the buck. They appear to be the experts on such matters
Wow back from Google of the Paddler Gods . 2 Stingray and i forgot the other . Lots of bone talk and bloodletting . The occurrence of the Bone meme is starting to creep me out a little . Something about bones right now! One more bone written and I am going to scream. Unless it is me calling out bones
Oh that is funny . I looked at older writings . Your not going to believe this . It talked about cutting up bones . Cut you down by calling you bones . Oh that is funny as can be . Any you check that out . Tikal stuff .
Is it Me ? Is it just Me . Can anyone else read the hidden language yet ? God i look for the day I am not alone . I am thinking I am not alone , but the ones that can see it have kept it a secret. I tell you what ? The power of knowing how to speak it is overwhelming . I don't know how Jesus coped with it. Oh yeah forgot . He didn't . He was a quitter . He gave into the language . Did what it told him to do like a good little boy/son/ not a father. Not Me . I am not going that way and if anybody gets the bright idea i need to be cut up into little pieces good look with that . It will not be an easy job . Pack a lunch cause it will take you all day .
21st May 2012 - 03:05 AM
I made a typo back there. 'widely', not 'wisely'
My stance is neutral; I would never say it was done wisely. I'm merely trying to give the bird's eye view. They use it, they have for a long time, it has yielded results that inspire them to continue, that's all. Not trying to be a pr man; just reporting the facts.
21st May 2012 - 10:59 AM
QUOTE (El_Machinae+May 20 2012, 03:08 PM)
Why would a corporation use dowsing?
Iím not aware of any that do. Iíd be interested in an example of a corporation that does.
At least one oilman has sense enough to know its limitations
George Starozik leads a double life, one conventional and the other distinctly less so. The 81-year-old founder of Camaro Drilling Ltd., has piloted his firm since 1978 without posting a single annual loss, he still manages its daily affairs and he's the second-longest serving director of the Canadian Association of Oilwell Drilling Contractors. As a sideline, Starozik (shown here) has also been quietly dowsing for oil and gas almost as long as he's drilled for it.
Starozik is no fanatic. He hasn't gambled his corporate or personal finances on what he recognizes as a technique that's still largely unproven.http://www.oilandgasinquirer.com/article.a...008_MO0001.html
If there are successful companies that engage in superstitious activity such as dowsing, itís because ultimately their success isnít dependent on it. They achieve success in spite of their superstitions.http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/81/mgoldsmith.html
Apparently professional dowsing is so lucrative that its practitioners donít need Randiís million dollar prize. So hereís a humanitarian alternative to prove the merit of their skills.
21st May 2012 - 02:48 PM
Anecdotes aren't data. Opinions shaped by confirmation bias aren't data. Advertising pitches aren't data.
Dowsing doesn't work reliably because trying a guess without data doesn't work reliably.
Gordon Ramsey's television show Kitchen Nightmares typically visits "failing"* restaurants where the owners/managers have no prior experience and are deep in debt. These people have dowsed their way to being business failures -- they don't know what they are doing and are just performing a "magic ritual" of going to work without a reliable theory of how showing up at work translates into business profit. They have bought into the lie that hard work equals success even when it is obvious that all the hard work in the world won't save a business when they aren't giving customers what they want.
* "Failing" here is in scare quotes, because the situation is not akin to an average student failing a test in a classroom setting; rather, typically the owners show no history of business or restaurant knowledge at all. It would like me being asked to take an entrance exam for a Thai traditional art school.
Dowsing is a similar magic ritual that based on the same human motor system glitches as the Ouiji board. Typically the field is prospecting, not restaurant success. If you prospect for common things like water or oil in places where geology favors oil pockets, you will have a certain measure of success no matter your technique. If you want to demonstrate the success of dowsing, you need scientific papers demonstrating that this methodology is not just successful, but more successful than chance and regional geography alone account for.
That is what is claimed, but that is not what the magazine and web articles show.
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